1
00:00:00,000 --> 00:00:05,220
to podcasting 2.0 for September
18 2020. This is episode number

2
00:00:05,220 --> 00:00:16,710
three, our first board meeting.
Bo, AR D, Bo R Ed. Reinventing

3
00:00:16,710 --> 00:00:22,560
something reimagining a lot.
It's time. We have a quorum. I

4
00:00:22,560 --> 00:00:26,490
believe I hear Dave Jones there.
Dave, my partner in podcasting

5
00:00:26,490 --> 00:00:27,390
index.org

6
00:00:28,110 --> 00:00:30,180
Second emotion you put out?

7
00:00:30,930 --> 00:00:33,990
We have literally not spoken to
each other. I think we talked to

8
00:00:33,990 --> 00:00:36,090
each other on the phone since
the last podcast. I

9
00:00:36,090 --> 00:00:37,800
don't think so. Absolutely not.

10
00:00:39,240 --> 00:00:41,580
That you've also been heads down
because you've had a lot going

11
00:00:41,580 --> 00:00:45,210
on at work. And we both have
actual other day jobs.

12
00:00:45,630 --> 00:00:47,880
You have like 16 podcasts you're
doing right now.

13
00:00:48,360 --> 00:00:51,150
Yeah, it's nice though, because
the studio is getting a lot of

14
00:00:51,150 --> 00:00:54,240
use. And I got my new my new
desk coming, which I've been

15
00:00:54,240 --> 00:00:58,890
waiting for. Oh, man, three
months now I think accustomed as

16
00:00:59,190 --> 00:01:04,710
well coming. Hopefully next
week, you know, this is the guy

17
00:01:04,710 --> 00:01:09,450
drew drew T who I found here in
Austin, who moved to California.

18
00:01:10,020 --> 00:01:12,930
Yeah, exactly. So you know,
Joanie to the desk, he's like,

19
00:01:13,680 --> 00:01:17,730
alright, I'll put mine on hold.
And he made the actually made

20
00:01:17,730 --> 00:01:22,620
the table. That's a nice ass
table doesn't quite show up,

21
00:01:22,620 --> 00:01:24,990
right? In the new studio
settings, I guess?

22
00:01:25,380 --> 00:01:28,380
Is it going to have like a, like
a stain? Or is it gonna be raw

23
00:01:28,380 --> 00:01:28,950
or what? Like,

24
00:01:28,980 --> 00:01:32,640
no laminated mines will be the
one I have. Now. It's, it's a

25
00:01:32,640 --> 00:01:36,390
geek desk. So it's adjustable in
height up and down. Yeah, I've

26
00:01:36,390 --> 00:01:41,970
had this for years, I've had
this for gosh, I want to say six

27
00:01:41,970 --> 00:01:45,750
years, I had two of them
actually one point. And the

28
00:01:45,750 --> 00:01:49,050
motor, still a good knock on
wood. So just replacing the

29
00:01:49,050 --> 00:01:53,070
whole top with an entire new
custom custom setup. And it's

30
00:01:53,070 --> 00:01:57,720
custom for me because I like to
take the same rig that I use

31
00:01:57,750 --> 00:02:00,810
here at home in the studio when
I'm going on the road. So it has

32
00:02:00,810 --> 00:02:05,010
to continue. It's not going to
be rack mounted. Basically, I

33
00:02:05,010 --> 00:02:07,830
decided on this portable rig
just so much easier, man, even

34
00:02:07,830 --> 00:02:11,100
just having a different laptop
on the road, and you fire that

35
00:02:11,100 --> 00:02:14,880
thing up. It's like, Oh, hold
on, why don't you wait a day?

36
00:02:14,880 --> 00:02:18,870
Well, Windows 10 figures out
where you've been all this time.

37
00:02:19,650 --> 00:02:22,380
You see like you're totally
deconstruct double mean you can

38
00:02:22,380 --> 00:02:25,200
take the whole thing apart and
just throw it in a case and take

39
00:02:25,200 --> 00:02:25,530
it away.

40
00:02:25,560 --> 00:02:28,740
Not even that it's just I got an
over the shoulder camera bag.

41
00:02:28,770 --> 00:02:33,300
That's that's the majority of
it. And I put the microphone

42
00:02:33,300 --> 00:02:38,340
boom arm in the suitcase. And
then I have a little I have a

43
00:02:38,340 --> 00:02:41,490
small roller bag, which I can
just put all kinds of stuff in

44
00:02:41,490 --> 00:02:45,870
and and I'll put the screens in
there because I got three I was

45
00:02:45,870 --> 00:02:52,560
a surface Surface Pro six I
think and and then I have two

46
00:02:52,560 --> 00:02:53,280
screens.

47
00:02:54,420 --> 00:02:55,980
Just surface go on I

48
00:02:55,980 --> 00:02:59,250
have the surface the surface go
is my go to machine. That's my

49
00:02:59,250 --> 00:03:03,750
daily driver running Ubuntu. I
love that machine. It's I mean,

50
00:03:03,840 --> 00:03:07,020
I can't take advantage of any of
the touchscreen or any of that.

51
00:03:07,380 --> 00:03:10,530
But it's just such a nice small
little keyboard the format's

52
00:03:10,530 --> 00:03:13,740
perfect, you can clap that thing
up. Almost put it in your back

53
00:03:13,740 --> 00:03:16,230
pocket, take it along. I liked
that thing a lot.

54
00:03:16,619 --> 00:03:21,419
But in it slow. Like, I've heard
everybody knocks on it because

55
00:03:21,419 --> 00:03:24,719
it's slow. And if you're running
like virtual machine with Ubuntu

56
00:03:24,749 --> 00:03:25,739
or arm Yeah, I'm

57
00:03:25,740 --> 00:03:26,880
running virtual machine.

58
00:03:28,380 --> 00:03:30,240
You're getting away with it.
Well, I have the

59
00:03:30,360 --> 00:03:35,850
SSD. So I got the eight gig. Was
it eight gigs of RAM memory?

60
00:03:35,880 --> 00:03:40,140
Yeah. And then I think it's 256
gigs SSD, that the SSD is what

61
00:03:40,140 --> 00:03:44,550
makes all the difference as
usual. Yeah. And yeah, so I have

62
00:03:44,550 --> 00:03:48,780
a virtual machine on a USB
drive, which I do. I mean,

63
00:03:48,810 --> 00:03:51,570
that's my whole my whole life is
on a USB drive. And I have it

64
00:03:51,690 --> 00:03:53,730
installed on three different
computers.

65
00:03:54,180 --> 00:03:57,300
That's weird as comic strip
blogger run in Linux on his

66
00:03:57,300 --> 00:04:02,130
iPad. I still don't understand
it's somehow I wrote example

67
00:04:02,130 --> 00:04:03,210
code in it. I saw it

68
00:04:03,210 --> 00:04:07,650
I saw it. Well, let's first of
all, let's This is the two

69
00:04:07,650 --> 00:04:11,490
thirds of the of the
organizations here. So this is

70
00:04:11,490 --> 00:04:14,610
an actual kind of partner board
meeting and we haven't really

71
00:04:15,000 --> 00:04:18,390
updated each other there's a lot
a lot of stuff to cover since

72
00:04:18,660 --> 00:04:21,480
because we kind of Yeah, we
opened up the you know, the call

73
00:04:21,480 --> 00:04:25,710
the launch but the the API is
open we've got to some people

74
00:04:25,800 --> 00:04:30,330
let me just make sure that I've
that I've got that I've got

75
00:04:30,330 --> 00:04:33,180
everybody here on the list. I so
for we we had pod news who have

76
00:04:33,180 --> 00:04:38,910
integrated podcasts index.org
with their search, then we have

77
00:04:40,080 --> 00:04:44,130
fireside which is Dan Benjamin.
Now and he's now

78
00:04:44,910 --> 00:04:47,850
Dan Benjamin. Five and

79
00:04:48,360 --> 00:04:50,790
Dan Benjamin has like 18
Different companies.

80
00:04:51,180 --> 00:04:51,630
Okay.

81
00:04:53,970 --> 00:04:57,150
He's Uh, he's here in Austin.
And he actually integrated

82
00:04:57,150 --> 00:05:00,210
pretty early on I had somehow I
didn't really see that he had on

83
00:05:00,210 --> 00:05:03,120
that, because you gotta let me
know people when when, when

84
00:05:03,120 --> 00:05:06,600
you've done something. Yesterday
we had the Captivate launch,

85
00:05:06,600 --> 00:05:08,760
which is really nice because
they did a whole professional

86
00:05:09,030 --> 00:05:12,570
press release. And it was fine.
I was like, Oh, let me write a

87
00:05:12,570 --> 00:05:15,270
quote from me. Let me see what
I'm going to say. What do you

88
00:05:15,270 --> 00:05:17,100
think of my quote, I liked my
quote, there's like,

89
00:05:18,119 --> 00:05:21,209
I was beautiful. I mean, it was
like it was it was so it was

90
00:05:21,209 --> 00:05:27,719
amazing. You blew me away with
that, please. Like, you know,

91
00:05:27,719 --> 00:05:31,829
they get the MCO it would have
been, that's great.

92
00:05:34,020 --> 00:05:36,330
But you'll get to do your
quotes, as many as you were many

93
00:05:36,330 --> 00:05:39,630
as that's great. By the way,
Dave is in Unit server room and

94
00:05:39,630 --> 00:05:42,090
a data data warehouse where yes,

95
00:05:42,090 --> 00:05:45,840
sorry, as I got I got UPS units
blowing. It's okay.

96
00:05:45,840 --> 00:05:49,650
So if people are wondering what
the noises, we even move my mic

97
00:05:49,680 --> 00:05:53,910
now I don't worry about it. We
have a full on full on

98
00:05:53,910 --> 00:05:58,500
integration into the hyper
Capture app. I think that's

99
00:05:58,500 --> 00:06:01,170
using it. Now. They're using us
completely, or they have their

100
00:06:01,170 --> 00:06:04,020
own user search. That's okay.
Yeah, he's

101
00:06:04,020 --> 00:06:08,070
switched over to search for us.
But then he's using I think he's

102
00:06:08,070 --> 00:06:11,790
still pulling the feeds locally
for that, which to me is great.

103
00:06:11,820 --> 00:06:12,120
Yeah.

104
00:06:12,270 --> 00:06:15,750
That's great combo. It's a great
combo. So what am I now besides

105
00:06:15,780 --> 00:06:19,500
when we want to talk about some
people, some some developers

106
00:06:19,500 --> 00:06:22,350
who've come in and some of the
things that it might be actually

107
00:06:22,350 --> 00:06:24,510
easy if I say, Okay, here's what
I'm seeing, you could tell me

108
00:06:24,510 --> 00:06:27,750
what's really going on because
we opened up a mastodon

109
00:06:27,750 --> 00:06:30,270
instance, which I think is
probably a good idea.

110
00:06:30,930 --> 00:06:33,900
That turned out when you first
said that I was like, oh, man,

111
00:06:33,900 --> 00:06:36,000
it's another place to check. I'm
not sure how that's gonna work.

112
00:06:36,000 --> 00:06:39,060
But then, like he's turned out.
And that's been great. It's been

113
00:06:39,060 --> 00:06:42,540
really great to have like a
direct pipeline. But I like

114
00:06:42,540 --> 00:06:47,160
Mastodon because it's not. It's
not. What I don't like about

115
00:06:47,160 --> 00:06:51,330
things like Slack, is that they
expect you to be all over them

116
00:06:51,330 --> 00:06:54,660
all the time. It's so instant.
And it's like it just, it just

117
00:06:54,660 --> 00:06:58,440
tethers you to a certain thing,
or slack is easier. Slack

118
00:06:58,440 --> 00:07:02,010
is completely evil. It is
ruining children in our

119
00:07:02,010 --> 00:07:05,880
corporations in America. I have
invested in it because of this

120
00:07:05,880 --> 00:07:10,170
reason. I like wow. I should buy
some show. Yeah, I made like

121
00:07:10,530 --> 00:07:15,420
$800 or something on just before
the lockdown like, and then I

122
00:07:15,420 --> 00:07:19,800
saw it go all the way down like
Oh, I'm fucked down here. I just

123
00:07:19,800 --> 00:07:22,350
let it sit. And then I was like,
oh, okay, made some money.

124
00:07:22,920 --> 00:07:26,340
Because I had seen it. I knew
what slack was. It's like, I

125
00:07:26,340 --> 00:07:29,970
know, Microsoft is going after
them with teams. And then with

126
00:07:29,970 --> 00:07:34,080
zooms, crack, but it's well,
it's and the kids don't like it.

127
00:07:34,110 --> 00:07:36,840
I mean, yeah, they do. But I
think it's destructive because

128
00:07:36,840 --> 00:07:39,270
you can create the private
channels and bitch and moan

129
00:07:39,270 --> 00:07:43,110
about people and then of course,
an admin you know, can be

130
00:07:43,110 --> 00:07:46,440
convinced for the CEO to go look
at those channels. He just saw a

131
00:07:46,440 --> 00:07:49,980
bad idea and it's in your
pocket. It's bleeping has got

132
00:07:49,980 --> 00:07:53,910
bad counts everything he's
mastered crack is corporate

133
00:07:53,910 --> 00:07:56,760
crack. Yeah, it is. It is the
BlackBerry of social networks.

134
00:07:56,760 --> 00:07:57,960
That's a pretty good, pretty
good.

135
00:07:59,040 --> 00:08:01,590
That's that's a terribly
accurate. So.

136
00:08:01,950 --> 00:08:05,160
So the mastodon instance, and I
decided to eat my own dog food,

137
00:08:05,160 --> 00:08:07,200
because I'm always telling
everybody and you don't need

138
00:08:07,200 --> 00:08:10,830
these, these. You don't need to
go Silicon Valley companies for

139
00:08:10,830 --> 00:08:14,730
things doesn't GitHub, of
course. Now I was also really as

140
00:08:14,730 --> 00:08:18,390
Microsoft. Although it's still
functioning the way it should,

141
00:08:18,390 --> 00:08:23,040
as far as I can tell. But
there's this kid think isn't

142
00:08:23,280 --> 00:08:27,060
just a kid, things Hugo, he may
be in Portugal, actually. And a

143
00:08:27,450 --> 00:08:30,060
couple years back when I was
sitting up, no agenda

144
00:08:30,060 --> 00:08:36,060
social.com. I found this Masto
dot host ma s t o dot h o s t.

145
00:08:36,450 --> 00:08:42,000
And he does virtual instances. I
think it used to be six, like

146
00:08:42,000 --> 00:08:45,720
five euros a month. And his
basic plan is now nine. But I

147
00:08:45,720 --> 00:08:48,780
think the most you you can go up
to for really a full on full

148
00:08:48,780 --> 00:08:54,540
blown instance, is like 39
euros. So I took some middle

149
00:08:54,540 --> 00:08:57,420
tier option, but the guy is
really good. And he gets it up

150
00:08:57,420 --> 00:08:59,700
and running for you pretty
quick. And I've never had a

151
00:08:59,700 --> 00:09:00,480
problem with it.

152
00:09:01,260 --> 00:09:04,830
It's so is it one of those. So
is it like go to a website and

153
00:09:04,830 --> 00:09:07,110
launch it? Or is it like you
contact him and say, hey, I want

154
00:09:07,110 --> 00:09:09,090
it can you tell me something and
he just you know, you

155
00:09:09,090 --> 00:09:13,830
go to a website Masto dot host
and and you input everything and

156
00:09:13,830 --> 00:09:17,940
then it says okay, we'll send
you an email. Now I set this up

157
00:09:18,000 --> 00:09:21,750
one evening, and there was a
screen that came back. It's 4am

158
00:09:21,750 --> 00:09:27,600
Now in Portugal, but the minute
our staff Hugo wakes up. Right

159
00:09:27,600 --> 00:09:28,770
this right on this for

160
00:09:28,770 --> 00:09:31,290
you? Wow, man, he's Johnny on
the spot.

161
00:09:31,320 --> 00:09:33,990
Yeah, well, and he has quite
some infrastructure. He's good.

162
00:09:33,990 --> 00:09:36,510
I don't know. I've just seen him
flourish. And I'm really, really

163
00:09:36,510 --> 00:09:39,120
happy because that's the kind of
thing that especially because of

164
00:09:39,120 --> 00:09:43,650
the federated nature of it, can
work can work really well just

165
00:09:43,650 --> 00:09:46,080
for small groups. And this is
the first test I've done outside

166
00:09:46,080 --> 00:09:50,280
of no agenda social. So it's
podcast, index dot social. And

167
00:09:50,280 --> 00:09:54,360
you can get a click on the
invite from our developer page

168
00:09:54,390 --> 00:09:59,970
API dot podcast index.org or hit
us up if you need one. So yeah,

169
00:10:00,000 --> 00:10:03,000
That seems to be working pretty
well. And within a short amount

170
00:10:03,000 --> 00:10:05,970
of time, I think we have 50
people on there a combo of

171
00:10:05,970 --> 00:10:12,630
users. Developers, we saw a
young master Trent come in who

172
00:10:12,630 --> 00:10:16,320
was here in Austin, and he's
doing some design on the, on the

173
00:10:16,350 --> 00:10:20,430
web pages itself. Of course, the
infamous comic strip blogger who

174
00:10:20,430 --> 00:10:26,370
I have to say is impressed me to
a great degree with his with his

175
00:10:26,490 --> 00:10:30,750
insight and coding skills. And,
you know, I've had a long, long,

176
00:10:30,750 --> 00:10:33,690
long relationship with comics
through blogger going back to

177
00:10:33,690 --> 00:10:36,780
the pretty much the beginning of
podcasting daily source code

178
00:10:36,780 --> 00:10:44,460
days. That's Dutch. Now he's
polish. Okay, I think he's Yeah,

179
00:10:44,460 --> 00:10:47,550
I'm not sure what nationality he
has. But I think he comes from

180
00:10:47,550 --> 00:10:53,940
Poland. And, yeah, he's he's
doing some code, and you seem to

181
00:10:54,000 --> 00:10:55,470
be vibing with him?

182
00:10:56,160 --> 00:11:00,390
Oh, yeah. Yeah, no, he puts out
stuff. And I mean, I've like

183
00:11:00,390 --> 00:11:06,000
half. Well, I split off the
GitHub organization to split it

184
00:11:06,000 --> 00:11:11,370
off into two, two groups. Now we
have all the all the the podcast

185
00:11:11,370 --> 00:11:14,970
index proper stuff in them. Now
we have a separate organization,

186
00:11:14,970 --> 00:11:18,210
for example, code. And literally
two thirds of the example code.

187
00:11:18,210 --> 00:11:19,920
org is, is comic strip blogger.

188
00:11:20,490 --> 00:11:23,340
What kind of what kind of code
is this? What did these bits of

189
00:11:23,340 --> 00:11:24,030
code do?

190
00:11:24,750 --> 00:11:27,690
Well, there, I've been real
happy because people have been

191
00:11:27,690 --> 00:11:30,930
posting example code and just
taking the format and the

192
00:11:30,930 --> 00:11:34,620
template of the other, I guess,
I think Mr. Bulger kind of

193
00:11:34,620 --> 00:11:39,360
started this whole thing. It
basically just has his code in a

194
00:11:39,360 --> 00:11:44,040
certain style naming convention.
And the way he does it with the

195
00:11:44,730 --> 00:11:47,670
API key separated and that kind
of stuff. And he so he kind of

196
00:11:47,670 --> 00:11:50,220
set the standard, and
everybody's just kind of falling

197
00:11:50,220 --> 00:11:54,120
in when other people submit or
example code. They are pretty

198
00:11:54,120 --> 00:11:57,750
much just kind of following that
same format. Works great. Yeah.

199
00:11:57,930 --> 00:11:59,040
The star naming

200
00:11:59,070 --> 00:12:01,920
Yes. starts the beginning that
just kind of sticks. And

201
00:12:01,920 --> 00:12:04,980
everybody does. That is
beautiful. Yeah, it's working.

202
00:12:04,980 --> 00:12:06,780
Now. It's also where there's
stuff that will do that will

203
00:12:06,780 --> 00:12:09,840
regret, regret and 20 years from
now, like, fuck, why did we do

204
00:12:09,840 --> 00:12:10,050
that?

205
00:12:11,280 --> 00:12:13,890
Oh, yeah, we may regret this
little thing in six months.

206
00:12:15,210 --> 00:12:19,230
So the code that he's submitting
is that code for integrating

207
00:12:19,230 --> 00:12:23,220
into different languages. So you
can access the API or so it's

208
00:12:23,220 --> 00:12:26,370
just like a star. Hello, World
type thing?

209
00:12:26,640 --> 00:12:29,460
Yeah, it's all hello world to
get hooked up to the API. So

210
00:12:29,460 --> 00:12:36,150
there's one and there's a
there's go, there's Node js,

211
00:12:36,150 --> 00:12:44,250
there's Swift, C sharp, Java.
Python, Lisp, and flooded the

212
00:12:44,250 --> 00:12:46,710
list now not all these are
coming through blogger he's,

213
00:12:47,340 --> 00:12:52,830
I think, wasn't one of our how
someone on podcasts index dot

214
00:12:52,830 --> 00:13:02,250
social talking about doing a
what is the not vi but emacs

215
00:13:02,250 --> 00:13:04,110
doing an emacs integration? Is
that what the

216
00:13:04,110 --> 00:13:06,510
list was for? And maybe Yeah,

217
00:13:07,650 --> 00:13:10,440
I think I saw someone posting a
guy always wanted to pod a

218
00:13:10,440 --> 00:13:14,730
podcast app in my Emacs. Oh,
that's what Now that's cool.

219
00:13:14,760 --> 00:13:18,120
That's, that's very weird. But I
think Yeah,

220
00:13:18,630 --> 00:13:24,960
Matt, is the guy's name that
that did the E lisp. I don't say

221
00:13:24,960 --> 00:13:27,150
his last time he is the guy that
did that.

222
00:13:28,260 --> 00:13:31,650
For those of you tuning in
wondering, is this just about,

223
00:13:31,680 --> 00:13:38,250
you know, a bunch of coders? No.
We have has set this up as a

224
00:13:38,250 --> 00:13:42,600
project to see kind of where the
community takes it. We have some

225
00:13:42,600 --> 00:13:46,590
general ideas and, and some,
some vision of what we want to

226
00:13:46,590 --> 00:13:50,160
do with it. Obviously, there's a
little bit of confusion or not

227
00:13:50,160 --> 00:13:54,180
as much as I expected. People
saying, Oh, how do I how do I

228
00:13:54,180 --> 00:13:57,900
get my my podcast in the index?
And that seems to be something

229
00:13:57,900 --> 00:14:00,990
that we could focus on right
now. As I said, we already have

230
00:14:00,990 --> 00:14:04,770
a couple people who have systems
that help you list into the

231
00:14:04,770 --> 00:14:10,590
index. Do we have other apps or
or posters or anything on the

232
00:14:10,590 --> 00:14:14,100
horizon? I saw Todd Cochran
hanging around Don't worry, he's

233
00:14:14,100 --> 00:14:15,630
going to participate.

234
00:14:16,080 --> 00:14:19,650
I don't know. I hadn't heard
anything on that. No. CEOs

235
00:14:19,650 --> 00:14:23,430
rss.com Those guys, aren't they?
Are they auto submitting?

236
00:14:23,670 --> 00:14:28,020
Ah, yeah, I think so. Who were
they again? I remember seeing

237
00:14:28,020 --> 00:14:29,430
them I know that we're going to

238
00:14:31,290 --> 00:14:36,540
I think I think transistor may
be as well. transistors. What's

239
00:14:36,540 --> 00:14:41,700
wrong with the last show? John
Buddha is the guy's name it that

240
00:14:41,880 --> 00:14:48,240
from transistor. He was a melt a
couple of times. The I think

241
00:14:48,420 --> 00:14:51,540
those are the ones we know to
talk about that for a second.

242
00:14:53,640 --> 00:14:58,830
You know, there's no real public
way to add feeds to the to the

243
00:14:58,830 --> 00:15:01,710
index and I I am completely
comfortable with that at the

244
00:15:01,710 --> 00:15:05,370
moment. Me too. Me too, you
know, go ahead, there's so much

245
00:15:05,370 --> 00:15:10,140
sensitivity around duplicate
feeds and feed fraud and that

246
00:15:10,140 --> 00:15:14,850
type of deal. And what what I
would really love more than

247
00:15:14,850 --> 00:15:22,800
anything is to is for the like,
for the developer portal to be

248
00:15:22,800 --> 00:15:27,270
the only place to add feeds for,
for the foreseeable future. And

249
00:15:27,270 --> 00:15:33,060
for most of the feeds and the
podcast, data to come in, from

250
00:15:33,180 --> 00:15:37,290
podcast networks and publishers,
right, because we, I mean, we

251
00:15:37,290 --> 00:15:40,860
trust those guys, we already
have a system set up where in

252
00:15:40,860 --> 00:15:44,670
order to you can't add a feed,
except manually through the

253
00:15:44,670 --> 00:15:50,550
developer portal. Or if unless
you have a read write API key.

254
00:15:51,240 --> 00:15:55,170
And you have to ask permission,
you have to request that and we

255
00:15:55,170 --> 00:15:57,900
review and review each one of
those to make sure it's not

256
00:15:57,900 --> 00:16:04,110
some, you know, janky, made up
Gmail address. And then, you

257
00:16:04,110 --> 00:16:09,000
know, if for batch adding a
feeds to the index, you have to

258
00:16:09,000 --> 00:16:11,610
have a publisher key. And that's
a manual process, you can't even

259
00:16:11,610 --> 00:16:16,140
request that. So for people
like, you know, transistor and

260
00:16:16,140 --> 00:16:22,560
captivate in, in these guys,
fireside that they can get a

261
00:16:22,560 --> 00:16:27,870
publisher key. And that makes
the whole process is simple for

262
00:16:27,870 --> 00:16:32,370
them. And also, it makes sure
that we don't get in a situation

263
00:16:32,370 --> 00:16:35,490
where we have somebody just
dumping garbage feeds into the

264
00:16:35,490 --> 00:16:43,170
index, of which we can roll that
back we, we have a we have logs,

265
00:16:43,170 --> 00:16:47,130
but we also have a table that
records every fee to get added

266
00:16:47,370 --> 00:16:50,910
and which developer account it
came from. So if we notice

267
00:16:50,910 --> 00:16:53,550
shenanigans in there, we can
immediately Yeah, we

268
00:16:53,550 --> 00:16:56,430
can take it down the line and
find out contact people or

269
00:16:56,430 --> 00:16:59,310
contact and say, Hey, what's
going on, figure out who's doing

270
00:16:59,310 --> 00:16:59,970
what to whom,

271
00:17:00,390 --> 00:17:04,980
yeah, and if it was, if it was
shenanigans, we can, we can just

272
00:17:04,980 --> 00:17:08,160
roll it back and take all those
feeds out, somebody dumped 100,

273
00:17:08,190 --> 00:17:10,230
you know, fraud fades in there,
we can just pull it out.

274
00:17:10,440 --> 00:17:13,410
So I like this a lot, because it
really brings together the

275
00:17:13,410 --> 00:17:16,950
entire community. And I would
say most hosting companies are

276
00:17:16,980 --> 00:17:19,170
you know, they're commercial,
but they're independent and

277
00:17:19,170 --> 00:17:22,800
commercial in nature. So if
you're hosting a podcast, if

278
00:17:22,800 --> 00:17:26,880
you're using one of these, one
of the services, you know, shoot

279
00:17:26,880 --> 00:17:32,310
him an email and ask him to add
to add the podcast index.org to

280
00:17:32,310 --> 00:17:35,400
their feed submission process,
which I think most of them have

281
00:17:35,400 --> 00:17:35,820
now.

282
00:17:36,510 --> 00:17:40,320
Yeah. And I don't and it's, it's
so easy for them. I mean, like,

283
00:17:40,320 --> 00:17:43,860
it doesn't really require much
code at all. And they me it's

284
00:17:43,860 --> 00:17:47,040
really just a single API call
when somebody creates a new

285
00:17:47,040 --> 00:17:50,070
feed, if they want to auto
submit, or like Captivate, did

286
00:17:50,070 --> 00:17:53,010
they just put a, you know, an
extra button on their page that

287
00:17:53,010 --> 00:17:56,160
says, Oh, do you know, do you
want to submit to Apple, all

288
00:17:56,160 --> 00:18:00,060
these other ones will also know
about this one, too. I mean,

289
00:18:00,780 --> 00:18:03,270
what what I would like I don't
know how you feel about this.

290
00:18:03,270 --> 00:18:08,520
But I would like there to be the
same process in reverse as well.

291
00:18:08,520 --> 00:18:13,560
So like, one thing I think we
need is an eighth is an API

292
00:18:13,590 --> 00:18:19,860
call. That just lists basically
every feed that has been added,

293
00:18:20,340 --> 00:18:24,180
basically a firehose of feeds
that have been added. And so if

294
00:18:24,180 --> 00:18:26,760
somebody let's just say,
somebody else out there is

295
00:18:26,760 --> 00:18:29,280
running an index as well, or a
director,

296
00:18:29,879 --> 00:18:32,249
want to get our updates, then we
can just blow it to him,

297
00:18:32,249 --> 00:18:33,509
whatever they're missing. Yeah,

298
00:18:33,570 --> 00:18:35,550
you don't have to scrape as they
don't have to pull it. They

299
00:18:35,550 --> 00:18:36,090
don't have to,

300
00:18:37,200 --> 00:18:39,150
please, let's not scrape people.

301
00:18:39,990 --> 00:18:43,590
Yeah, don't don't do that. We're
gonna give you every possible

302
00:18:43,590 --> 00:18:48,030
way to get everything in the
index. And if as far as like, if

303
00:18:48,030 --> 00:18:51,570
all these other publishers and
networks are pushing to us, then

304
00:18:51,630 --> 00:18:54,240
we'll just pump it right back
out. Exactly. Just follow that

305
00:18:54,240 --> 00:18:57,240
one single fire hose feed, and
you don't have to even scrape or

306
00:18:57,240 --> 00:18:58,680
anything, and you'll get it all.

307
00:18:58,770 --> 00:19:02,130
I think it's really interesting
how, what we'll see how it goes.

308
00:19:02,130 --> 00:19:04,590
But as you were saying, there
was a lot of I think it's died

309
00:19:04,590 --> 00:19:09,120
down now. But there was some
conversation about, you know,

310
00:19:09,150 --> 00:19:12,570
bogus submissions and fraud
feeds. That was that was that's

311
00:19:12,570 --> 00:19:16,020
a big one. Right? I think the
fraud feed is really something

312
00:19:16,020 --> 00:19:19,080
that gets mitigated when we
have, you know, the partnership

313
00:19:19,110 --> 00:19:23,340
of hosting companies and
submission interfaces in between

314
00:19:23,340 --> 00:19:27,180
us and the person with the feet.
I think that that's that's kind

315
00:19:27,180 --> 00:19:30,810
of cool idea. Like it's a very
federated type of a way of doing

316
00:19:30,810 --> 00:19:34,590
it and I think it keeps it clean
but also still removes the

317
00:19:34,590 --> 00:19:38,520
process of Oh, please someone
approve it. No, you're in as

318
00:19:38,520 --> 00:19:41,370
long as you're not you know, as
your partner that you're doing

319
00:19:41,370 --> 00:19:44,640
your feed with. Sanctuary Okay,
with, it's good by us. That's

320
00:19:45,150 --> 00:19:46,980
some version of trust there. I
think it's good.

321
00:19:47,970 --> 00:19:50,640
But you know, if you're, if
you're, let's just be honest,

322
00:19:50,640 --> 00:19:54,300
there's not a lot of podcasts
out there that do what you do.

323
00:19:54,840 --> 00:20:00,540
So you have your own CDN. you
host your feed from your dynojet

324
00:20:00,540 --> 00:20:04,290
to feed and Mofaz feed from end
to end this feed from your own

325
00:20:04,290 --> 00:20:08,550
location. So you're completely
independent on the distribution

326
00:20:08,550 --> 00:20:13,170
side. And that's not very
common, most, most podcasters

327
00:20:13,440 --> 00:20:16,530
are going to go through a
publisher or some sort of

328
00:20:16,530 --> 00:20:20,010
network. And they'll pay, you
know, they'll pay for hosting or

329
00:20:20,010 --> 00:20:23,430
whatever they need to do. And so
if that's let's just say, I'm

330
00:20:23,430 --> 00:20:26,010
making up numbers here, and
let's just say that's, you know,

331
00:20:26,100 --> 00:20:33,540
80% plus of podcasts or follow
that model, then a loosely

332
00:20:33,540 --> 00:20:38,700
coupled system of directories,
like let's just say blueberry,

333
00:20:40,590 --> 00:20:45,540
captivate a transistor, all
these guys, Lipson, let's just

334
00:20:45,540 --> 00:20:49,800
say they're all feeding into
podcast index, and then we're

335
00:20:49,800 --> 00:20:53,400
feeding back out to all of them.
Well, when Lipson adds a new

336
00:20:53,400 --> 00:20:56,490
feed, it shows up in the fire
hose now blueberry, and all the

337
00:20:56,490 --> 00:21:00,420
rest of them can pick it up. We
all distribute amongst each

338
00:21:00,420 --> 00:21:06,210
other. And then what you have is
not a single silo of feeds,

339
00:21:06,330 --> 00:21:11,490
right? You everybody
participates? And if one element

340
00:21:11,490 --> 00:21:15,330
of that goes goes down, if Apple
goes off the radar, or, you

341
00:21:15,330 --> 00:21:18,300
know, whatever, the other ones,
yeah, then the whole thing still

342
00:21:18,300 --> 00:21:18,960
stands.

343
00:21:19,530 --> 00:21:23,430
I like that a lot. What I'm
missing, the one thing I

344
00:21:23,430 --> 00:21:28,830
expected to see someone show up
doing is a very simple web based

345
00:21:28,830 --> 00:21:34,680
search interface. Just a webpage
that has Oh, search the index.

346
00:21:34,980 --> 00:21:38,760
Yeah, yeah. It's like It's like
the easiest app to make. Any web

347
00:21:38,760 --> 00:21:42,780
developer I think can do it.
Yeah. It's just a simple web

348
00:21:42,780 --> 00:21:45,120
search. And then you can
everything's there. You can make

349
00:21:45,120 --> 00:21:51,090
beautiful results pages. You can
you can add icons for people to

350
00:21:51,090 --> 00:21:55,020
subscribe. It's such an such an
obvious one. I think it's too

351
00:21:55,020 --> 00:21:57,960
big that people can't see how,
Oh, I could do that. Because

352
00:21:57,960 --> 00:22:00,630
we're not doing it. You see,
that's, that's what that's what

353
00:22:00,630 --> 00:22:04,080
is so different. I think about
our approach is we don't want to

354
00:22:04,080 --> 00:22:09,030
compete for your, for your let's
just call it your customer. We

355
00:22:09,030 --> 00:22:11,880
want to provide you with all the
plumbing, and everything else is

356
00:22:11,880 --> 00:22:14,850
needed to preserve this to keep
it going. I mean, we just saw

357
00:22:14,850 --> 00:22:19,680
Amazon launch. Was it yesterday?
I think,

358
00:22:19,860 --> 00:22:21,000
yeah. What do you think about
that?

359
00:22:21,840 --> 00:22:25,800
Well, I of course, when, when
you have something like that you

360
00:22:25,800 --> 00:22:31,230
immediately download the app. I
don't use any. That's not true.

361
00:22:31,230 --> 00:22:36,600
I do use one or 2/3 party apps
from my, my smartphone at home.

362
00:22:37,170 --> 00:22:42,120
So I loaded the Amazon Music
podcast app, and immediately no

363
00:22:42,120 --> 00:22:45,180
agenda. What's in there, no
agenda. There's a shitload of no

364
00:22:45,180 --> 00:22:48,390
agenda, but not our show. Which
is good because I had not

365
00:22:48,390 --> 00:22:51,660
submitted it. But what was
interesting is just before we

366
00:22:51,660 --> 00:22:57,360
started today, I received an
email and it says your podcast

367
00:22:57,360 --> 00:23:01,890
is now on Amazon Music sent to
Adam mccurry.com. So if they

368
00:23:01,890 --> 00:23:05,400
were polling feeds, that's a now
of course, I have an account

369
00:23:05,400 --> 00:23:10,140
with Amazon. But I've never
logged into their podcast area.

370
00:23:10,140 --> 00:23:15,690
I've never submitted anything.
Hello, podcaster. I'm getting

371
00:23:15,690 --> 00:23:18,330
all giddy over the
personalization. Hey,

372
00:23:18,330 --> 00:23:25,110
broadcaster, like hey, loser.
Yeah, we're, we're excited to

373
00:23:25,110 --> 00:23:28,950
let you know that Amazon Music
has launched podcasts. I'm

374
00:23:28,950 --> 00:23:32,190
reading it with emphasis
intended, check out our shiny

375
00:23:32,190 --> 00:23:35,370
new Amazon Music podcast
homepage. And if you click on it

376
00:23:35,370 --> 00:23:38,430
on your phone, of course, he
goes straight to an app store,

377
00:23:38,430 --> 00:23:46,200
which I didn't want. I guess I
can I think I can log in on the

378
00:23:46,200 --> 00:23:50,400
browser here. Oh, yeah. Let me
just double check. Okay, so

379
00:23:51,390 --> 00:23:54,210
looking at it right now and
they've got it's very It's very

380
00:23:54,270 --> 00:23:58,380
typical, the top serial 99
Invisible What the fuck with

381
00:23:58,380 --> 00:24:02,790
Marc Maron radio lab? What's
Trending? I'm not sure how they

382
00:24:02,790 --> 00:24:05,280
know what well of course we know
how they know what's trending.

383
00:24:06,300 --> 00:24:11,070
No Rogan zero Rogan? I think
he's in there. But he's not

384
00:24:11,070 --> 00:24:13,410
being promoted because they're
going after they're going to

385
00:24:13,410 --> 00:24:18,030
also silo a whole bunch of
talent. No, Rogen is not in

386
00:24:18,030 --> 00:24:24,300
there. Now, okay. And if I do no
agenda, quite interesting. What

387
00:24:24,300 --> 00:24:27,750
I come up with it's a lot of it
I've seen on on the index on

388
00:24:27,780 --> 00:24:36,210
podcast index.org. Here, there's
no shows but no agenda, Sundays,

389
00:24:36,510 --> 00:24:41,160
no agenda chat. So we're not in
there. But they kind of act like

390
00:24:41,160 --> 00:24:44,070
it and I had to read the email a
couple times, because you come

391
00:24:44,070 --> 00:24:48,030
upon this line. If you've
already submitted your podcasts

392
00:24:48,240 --> 00:24:51,570
to our service. You can search
for your show here, which I just

393
00:24:51,570 --> 00:24:56,070
did. Click on search fields a
bag is a bag Yep. Click on the

394
00:24:56,070 --> 00:24:58,950
search field. Enter your show
name under podcast section. You

395
00:24:58,950 --> 00:25:01,530
should see your show art. All
you need to click a click on see

396
00:25:01,530 --> 00:25:03,840
all clicking your show or it
will take you to Amazon Music

397
00:25:03,840 --> 00:25:08,010
Show page. You can grab your
show page link by copying the

398
00:25:08,010 --> 00:25:12,510
URL. And then it says For
details on how to add a listen

399
00:25:12,510 --> 00:25:18,090
on Amazon Music button. They
don't really say, like, hey,

400
00:25:19,320 --> 00:25:21,060
submit if you're not on here.

401
00:25:21,750 --> 00:25:24,510
So does that mean you have you
have essentially, does that mean

402
00:25:24,540 --> 00:25:28,080
that no agenda has a like a
shadow page on there could be

403
00:25:28,080 --> 00:25:30,630
and if you do activate it, then
this like, boom, you're in

404
00:25:30,630 --> 00:25:30,840
there?

405
00:25:30,990 --> 00:25:34,980
Well, I don't see where you'd
activate or so here's the

406
00:25:35,070 --> 00:25:37,440
podcast, but you'd have to have
some kind of

407
00:25:39,780 --> 00:25:42,120
like go to your page and do all
this kind of stuff.

408
00:25:42,150 --> 00:25:45,930
I don't have a I don't have a
login, you know, I don't have a

409
00:25:46,590 --> 00:25:48,900
I'm not a pills, like they get
you teed up to where I mean,

410
00:25:48,900 --> 00:25:51,150
it's like, even if you blink
wrong, you're in there.

411
00:25:51,660 --> 00:25:55,860
Well, with me that would add
everything I own so much

412
00:25:55,860 --> 00:26:01,080
blinking. Yeah, true. So anyway,
I think we just became more

413
00:26:01,080 --> 00:26:06,600
relevant with what we're doing
to ensure to ensure that there's

414
00:26:06,600 --> 00:26:10,380
a lot going on, I mean, Amazon
their initial Terms of Service,

415
00:26:10,740 --> 00:26:13,470
which I did see, because they I
know they sent that to me. I saw

416
00:26:13,470 --> 00:26:17,130
that early, early on, which I
think they went back and change

417
00:26:17,130 --> 00:26:20,430
stated, you sign up for this.
You can't say anything

418
00:26:20,430 --> 00:26:23,250
disparaging about Amazon or
Amazon products. And there was a

419
00:26:23,250 --> 00:26:27,270
bit of outrage over that small
bit. And I think that got

420
00:26:27,270 --> 00:26:29,640
removed from the terms of
service, but I've never signed

421
00:26:29,640 --> 00:26:30,600
up. So I'm not in there.

422
00:26:31,950 --> 00:26:34,650
Anyway, and that's that's a
personal decision that that you

423
00:26:34,650 --> 00:26:36,990
made, right? Yeah, just yeah.

424
00:26:37,770 --> 00:26:42,480
Yes, it is. I mean, I haven't
really discussed it with with my

425
00:26:42,480 --> 00:26:46,020
partner Divorce Act, but I think
he would agree. Yeah, you know,

426
00:26:46,020 --> 00:26:51,060
people already know how to get
their podcast. It's when Google

427
00:26:51,060 --> 00:26:54,180
Play first started. And and
that's another you can't, you

428
00:26:54,180 --> 00:26:58,110
can't opt out of Google Play,
you have to put a piece of code

429
00:26:58,110 --> 00:27:01,110
in your feed. So Google knows
not to index it.

430
00:27:01,740 --> 00:27:05,070
Oh, like a robots dot txt. Yeah,
no, that

431
00:27:05,070 --> 00:27:08,160
literally, that is also an
option. But that will take

432
00:27:08,160 --> 00:27:10,560
several weeks. If that won't
show up. Of course, in Google

433
00:27:10,560 --> 00:27:13,740
search, they claim if you say I
don't want I don't want it

434
00:27:13,740 --> 00:27:17,910
listed there. And I just keep my
eye on it. I'm not really

435
00:27:17,910 --> 00:27:23,370
against against it, per se. But
if it has to be through an app,

436
00:27:23,370 --> 00:27:25,650
and now it's I don't want it
it's like you're making money

437
00:27:25,650 --> 00:27:28,290
off of our of our product, and
people can get it any other way

438
00:27:28,290 --> 00:27:33,930
they want. And how hard is it to
just push another app? Yeah, no,

439
00:27:34,110 --> 00:27:38,760
I'll be I think, can be Disney
plus, and Netflix and all that

440
00:27:38,760 --> 00:27:41,670
no one box overs an app. And
that's where you can get other

441
00:27:41,670 --> 00:27:44,940
stuff. And I'd like it to be a
multitude of cool apps.

442
00:27:45,810 --> 00:27:49,080
But you know, all you're doing
really, when you participate in

443
00:27:49,080 --> 00:27:52,530
that, and I'm not criticizing
him, but he does. But the real

444
00:27:52,530 --> 00:27:55,350
thing is, when you participate
in that sort of siloed system,

445
00:27:55,380 --> 00:28:00,180
you're just perpetuating that,
that propensity to, to build

446
00:28:00,480 --> 00:28:04,590
another silo and create more
exclusive content. And, you

447
00:28:04,590 --> 00:28:10,260
know, the, the exclusive the
exclusivity has been in the, you

448
00:28:10,260 --> 00:28:16,410
know, video game world has been
in the book, the book publishing

449
00:28:16,410 --> 00:28:20,550
world has been there for for a
long time. But now it's in the

450
00:28:20,550 --> 00:28:24,420
podcasting world, and ever, and
there's this go this land grab

451
00:28:24,420 --> 00:28:28,950
to try to get the next exclusive
thing into me, those aren't

452
00:28:28,950 --> 00:28:32,610
really even podcasts. I mean, if
it doesn't have a feed, it's not

453
00:28:32,610 --> 00:28:34,740
a podcast, it's just a, it's
just a show.

454
00:28:34,890 --> 00:28:37,170
Exactly. Exactly. So it's just

455
00:28:37,410 --> 00:28:40,470
like, all you're doing is
protect, you know, like, if, if,

456
00:28:40,800 --> 00:28:44,970
if you say, Okay, I want my
stuff in in your silo, well,

457
00:28:44,970 --> 00:28:50,550
then everybody, let's just say
you have 10,000 of the most

458
00:28:50,550 --> 00:28:57,150
popular podcasts, those 10,000
Just give legitimacy to that

459
00:28:57,210 --> 00:29:02,280
silos ability to have five
exclusive shows that nobody else

460
00:29:02,280 --> 00:29:06,390
gets to have, right. So they
they're just using your product,

461
00:29:06,390 --> 00:29:09,660
yes, to build their to build
their own exclusive product that

462
00:29:09,660 --> 00:29:10,470
you can't have.

463
00:29:10,620 --> 00:29:13,260
And we're and we're going to run
into a much bigger problem, I

464
00:29:13,260 --> 00:29:16,650
believe, because we've already
kind of sold ourselves and our

465
00:29:16,650 --> 00:29:20,190
souls down the river with the
whole app ecosystem, which you

466
00:29:20,190 --> 00:29:23,520
could have seen coming. I think
we talked about on the last week

467
00:29:23,520 --> 00:29:27,330
of the first episode. It's very
possible that someone who says

468
00:29:27,360 --> 00:29:32,010
although we have apps that are
doing it, someone says, oh, you

469
00:29:32,010 --> 00:29:34,950
know, you've got this app, you
connect to this open index, and

470
00:29:34,980 --> 00:29:39,840
as Google Play said about some
apps for Mastodon servers, or

471
00:29:39,840 --> 00:29:43,080
maybe all of them are where you
can connect to horrible hate

472
00:29:43,080 --> 00:29:47,040
speech. It's very possible that
that will get rejected, then the

473
00:29:47,070 --> 00:29:50,700
podcast app will get rejected
from the stores. That's how far

474
00:29:50,700 --> 00:29:55,890
we've let it come. So I would
say in addition to just a great

475
00:29:55,890 --> 00:29:58,980
page where you can search and
play around with some podcasts

476
00:29:58,980 --> 00:30:02,550
and you could add all kinds of
functionality in there. A lot of

477
00:30:02,550 --> 00:30:08,220
podcast apps will take an OPML
feed of Rs OPML file of RSS

478
00:30:08,220 --> 00:30:11,430
feeds, you could have that
import into your app. And

479
00:30:11,430 --> 00:30:13,560
there's a million things you can
do. But how about just a plain

480
00:30:13,560 --> 00:30:18,060
old web app? It would be great.
I would love to have a web app

481
00:30:18,060 --> 00:30:21,300
for my iPhone will be fantastic.

482
00:30:21,660 --> 00:30:25,110
It's just a, just a wrapper
around search and play. Yeah.

483
00:30:25,440 --> 00:30:27,810
So that's the kind of stuff that
I'm looking for. And I think

484
00:30:27,810 --> 00:30:30,420
that it's becoming more clear to
the developers that I've seen

485
00:30:30,870 --> 00:30:34,560
and witnessed the numbers that
are showing up like, Okay, wait

486
00:30:34,560 --> 00:30:38,490
a minute. And this is something
that legit, we can build out and

487
00:30:38,580 --> 00:30:41,610
tell me about some of the stuff
that has come up. I've seen a

488
00:30:41,610 --> 00:30:47,160
lot of talk about categories,
languages, geography, or Geo

489
00:30:47,160 --> 00:30:51,540
coordinates. Has, where are we
in that, because I saw a flurry

490
00:30:51,540 --> 00:30:53,820
of activity, I'm not sure what's
going on with it.

491
00:30:55,080 --> 00:30:59,880
That's where most of my work has
been, over the last couple of

492
00:30:59,880 --> 00:31:04,260
days has been with categories.
And we were tossing around some

493
00:31:04,260 --> 00:31:11,520
ideas on GitHub, about about how
to do that. And I'm trying to

494
00:31:11,520 --> 00:31:16,050
resist my tendency, which is to
like Blow, blow the whole thing

495
00:31:16,050 --> 00:31:18,960
up and create something more
simplistic, but that's not

496
00:31:18,960 --> 00:31:23,400
necessarily the best idea
always. I think James at pod

497
00:31:23,400 --> 00:31:27,390
news has, has brought a little
bit of balance to that. And I

498
00:31:27,390 --> 00:31:32,940
think what we're going to do is
basically a hybrid. In the apple

499
00:31:32,940 --> 00:31:38,100
podcast categories, have always
bothered me, because I have this

500
00:31:38,100 --> 00:31:45,570
just sort of innate dislike of
hierarchy of hierarchical

501
00:31:45,570 --> 00:31:50,520
category systems. I don't want I
don't it's, it's not a digital

502
00:31:50,520 --> 00:31:55,950
native type process. So there's,
to me, there's no, there's no

503
00:31:55,950 --> 00:32:02,310
reason when you have a database
or something that's fast search,

504
00:32:02,790 --> 00:32:06,060
where there's no reason where
you should have hierarchy in

505
00:32:06,060 --> 00:32:09,450
your categories. I much prefer
just a flat labeling

506
00:32:09,480 --> 00:32:14,160
you mean? So if you so if you
need to walk the tree, more or

507
00:32:14,160 --> 00:32:16,950
less, you have to go into stuff?
Is that what you mean? I mean,

508
00:32:16,950 --> 00:32:18,990
I'm thinking simplistically, of
course,

509
00:32:19,320 --> 00:32:24,900
well, so like, in, in Apple's
category system, you have games

510
00:32:24,900 --> 00:32:29,610
and hobbies. And then as a sub
category of games and hobbies,

511
00:32:29,610 --> 00:32:35,910
you have video games. So got it.
Like, to me, I don't, I just

512
00:32:35,910 --> 00:32:38,280
don't understand the reason for
the hierarchy.

513
00:32:38,490 --> 00:32:43,290
Seems to me like that hierarchy
can be created, after the fact

514
00:32:43,320 --> 00:32:45,240
the way someone wants to present
the data.

515
00:32:45,600 --> 00:32:47,580
Yeah. See, that's the thing. Oh,
my God,

516
00:32:47,580 --> 00:32:48,750
I'm a developer.

517
00:32:51,270 --> 00:32:53,910
Yeah, I'm gonna push this code
to you, you can finish it for

518
00:32:55,530 --> 00:32:58,140
as long as it's go, I don't
programming anything else?

519
00:32:58,320 --> 00:33:05,850
Oh, you only go on an iPad.
Okay. All right. You're good. So

520
00:33:05,940 --> 00:33:10,620
I don't, I just don't understand
the reason for that. And first,

521
00:33:10,620 --> 00:33:14,370
there's must be something within
Apple proper, the way they like

522
00:33:14,370 --> 00:33:16,560
that stuff, because a lot of
their stuff is hierarchical. And

523
00:33:16,560 --> 00:33:18,600
I just don't get it. But that's,
you know,

524
00:33:18,629 --> 00:33:23,459
well, to be fair, because of the
way they operate. They are both

525
00:33:23,459 --> 00:33:26,609
sides of the equation. So
they're the guy. They're the

526
00:33:26,609 --> 00:33:30,089
guys that have the index. And
they also have the app, and

527
00:33:30,089 --> 00:33:32,339
they've got the phone, and
they've got the people and

528
00:33:32,339 --> 00:33:35,489
they've got the whole the whole
kit and caboodle. And they want

529
00:33:35,489 --> 00:33:40,709
to they have their own idea of
how they want to present things.

530
00:33:40,709 --> 00:33:44,009
Because ultimately, I think
categories always comes back to

531
00:33:44,369 --> 00:33:48,329
what's popular. What's the chart
look like? You know, it's it's

532
00:33:48,329 --> 00:33:52,409
going to come back to that. And
it may it's for advertising

533
00:33:52,409 --> 00:33:55,469
purposes, it may be handy, but I
agree with you. You can just

534
00:33:55,469 --> 00:33:59,399
have video games, handheld
games, console games, PC games,

535
00:33:59,609 --> 00:34:03,989
iPhone games. And then on the
back end, anybody who has an I

536
00:34:03,989 --> 00:34:05,999
think that gosh, I'm just
realizing that now I'm

537
00:34:05,999 --> 00:34:09,719
understanding it. Any kind of
way you want to surface that

538
00:34:09,719 --> 00:34:12,689
data to make your own
categories. So we don't know

539
00:34:12,719 --> 00:34:13,949
there's no fight. Right?

540
00:34:14,429 --> 00:34:19,109
Okay, that's exactly right. So
the, what we, you, you kind of

541
00:34:19,109 --> 00:34:25,019
nailed it because so what we've
ended up settling on is both,

542
00:34:25,169 --> 00:34:29,249
okay, so you have you have the
standard Apple category list,

543
00:34:29,249 --> 00:34:32,549
which everybody kind of adheres
to nab, buddy, everybody

544
00:34:32,549 --> 00:34:37,139
understands it fine. Okay,
whatever. So, but then also,

545
00:34:37,319 --> 00:34:41,189
what we did is we took the that
Apple Categories list and just

546
00:34:41,189 --> 00:34:44,849
basically duplicated it and
converted it into just a flat

547
00:34:44,910 --> 00:34:48,000
flat list. Okay, and that yes,
and that goes in tandem, or how

548
00:34:48,000 --> 00:34:50,460
does that work? That's it. We're
just keeping one set of

549
00:34:50,460 --> 00:34:52,500
categories is fencing in there.

550
00:34:52,860 --> 00:34:56,910
That will fit? I don't know.
Well, actually.

551
00:34:58,830 --> 00:35:00,810
Yes, he will. Select.

552
00:35:01,470 --> 00:35:02,850
Fencing is not in there now.

553
00:35:02,940 --> 00:35:07,260
See, what's up with that. But
well, how do I get it? How do I

554
00:35:07,260 --> 00:35:09,150
get a category out? And that's
your

555
00:35:09,390 --> 00:35:11,730
that's your sport, right? Yes.
In your sport.

556
00:35:11,760 --> 00:35:15,540
I 40 years ago, I was quite
good.

557
00:35:16,170 --> 00:35:20,070
Okay. But you're still, if you
did a fencing podcast today and

558
00:35:20,070 --> 00:35:23,940
that had a category you would be
number one tomorrow would be

559
00:35:23,940 --> 00:35:24,210
number

560
00:35:24,210 --> 00:35:25,890
one on the charts. Yes.

561
00:35:28,560 --> 00:35:31,890
But Cricket Cricket is in there.
On cricket. Yes.

562
00:35:31,890 --> 00:35:35,700
Yeah. Okay. So but that's what
it's about. We question the

563
00:35:35,700 --> 00:35:39,390
categories ever get added as
this? were set in this good? And

564
00:35:39,390 --> 00:35:42,270
what if some new economic model
appears? Can we never have a

565
00:35:42,270 --> 00:35:44,400
category for that or a different
country?

566
00:35:45,090 --> 00:35:51,570
Yeah, I think that the
categories expand very slowly

567
00:35:51,570 --> 00:35:55,380
and with much deliberation,
because the way this is gonna

568
00:35:55,380 --> 00:36:02,700
work is that so you have an
apple category list, you had

569
00:36:03,150 --> 00:36:07,500
hobby, there's a category a top
level category called hobbies

570
00:36:07,500 --> 00:36:09,960
and games or games, hobbies, I
don't remember which order it

571
00:36:09,960 --> 00:36:14,520
comes in. So it's hobbies and
games. Well, now we have a label

572
00:36:14,730 --> 00:36:15,960
games and a label

573
00:36:15,990 --> 00:36:19,530
hobbies. Okay? And you can
combine those two boolean.

574
00:36:20,100 --> 00:36:25,440
Exactly. So what we'll do is if,
if somebody in the metadata that

575
00:36:25,440 --> 00:36:30,540
we return when somebody wants to
say this podcast has these

576
00:36:30,540 --> 00:36:34,770
categories, we will have the
list of categories, hobbies,

577
00:36:34,800 --> 00:36:38,640
games, bah, bah, bah, bah, bah,
blah. But they will also have

578
00:36:38,730 --> 00:36:42,960
something something if they if
they request it in APA format

579
00:36:42,960 --> 00:36:45,210
will give it back in hobbies and
games.

580
00:36:45,660 --> 00:36:48,180
I hate to be a douche about it.
Dave

581
00:36:49,260 --> 00:36:50,970
ditional up the

582
00:36:50,970 --> 00:36:55,560
fenced in podcast, Tokyo 2020
fencing podcast British fencing

583
00:36:55,560 --> 00:36:59,370
be you be different fencing,
podcast fencing, the exceedingly

584
00:36:59,370 --> 00:37:03,270
complicated sport you claim to
be master of fencing fanatics,

585
00:37:03,780 --> 00:37:08,550
USA fencing, Coach education,
the fencing update, I would have

586
00:37:08,550 --> 00:37:11,730
to work real hard man to be
number one in that category.

587
00:37:11,760 --> 00:37:14,370
If you get in there. You're
going to be an also ran p are

588
00:37:14,370 --> 00:37:15,870
not even going to be

589
00:37:16,050 --> 00:37:20,220
listed. People. Yeah, people
make one of these searches for

590
00:37:20,220 --> 00:37:24,300
yourself. This is great. Is this
is so fun. You said

591
00:37:24,690 --> 00:37:29,130
the saw somebody on Twitter the
other day? I think it was

592
00:37:29,640 --> 00:37:33,600
somebody got retweeted and they
said good morning, everyone.

593
00:37:34,320 --> 00:37:36,750
Just a reminder, you don't have
to start a podcast.

594
00:37:39,720 --> 00:37:41,640
Like, yeah, of course

595
00:37:41,640 --> 00:37:44,520
million and a half of which,
which also seemed the only

596
00:37:44,520 --> 00:37:47,070
category thing. That's why I've
not really been too concerned

597
00:37:47,070 --> 00:37:50,670
about it. Some people have been
like, you don't have categories?

598
00:37:51,240 --> 00:37:54,720
What the hell? I mean, like,
what do you do it? What do you

599
00:37:54,720 --> 00:37:57,390
been thinking? And I knew we
would get to and I mean, we're

600
00:37:57,390 --> 00:38:00,210
gonna get there eventually. But
and we're doing it right now.

601
00:38:00,570 --> 00:38:04,470
But the same time? Okay, there's
one and a half million podcasts

602
00:38:04,470 --> 00:38:09,090
out there. Like, what does it?
What does the category really

603
00:38:09,090 --> 00:38:12,030
get you? I mean, I think
everybody's gonna go into the

604
00:38:12,030 --> 00:38:15,510
index and say, Okay, show me all
the news podcasts and

605
00:38:15,930 --> 00:38:23,010
wants to see this. This is the
thinking, which I've never, I'm

606
00:38:23,010 --> 00:38:28,140
not so sure it works that well,
the thinking is, go look at look

607
00:38:28,140 --> 00:38:31,440
at it. I mean, if you look at
Amazon, or you look at Spotify,

608
00:38:31,440 --> 00:38:35,100
or look at Apple, that's
literally what they have news,

609
00:38:35,100 --> 00:38:41,580
podcasts music podcast. So it's
their vision of their consumer,

610
00:38:41,850 --> 00:38:44,820
which I think is probably right,
that's typical Apple consumer

611
00:38:44,820 --> 00:38:48,540
probably thinks that way. Yeah,
you know, if it were me, I'd be

612
00:38:48,540 --> 00:38:51,750
like, I'd like a category,
Public Radio. You know, to me,

613
00:38:51,750 --> 00:38:54,780
it's just tags, really. And that
brings me to my next question,

614
00:38:55,110 --> 00:38:58,140
which is, how good is the
search? The search that we have

615
00:38:58,140 --> 00:38:59,520
right now? How good is it?

616
00:39:01,680 --> 00:39:04,290
That I think that's gotta be an
open discussion, because I think

617
00:39:04,800 --> 00:39:08,580
I haven't not found what I'm
looking for yet. And that's but

618
00:39:08,670 --> 00:39:12,450
let's see, I think that comes
back to the fact that it just

619
00:39:12,450 --> 00:39:17,130
like, just like you, I've been
in the computer world so long,

620
00:39:17,340 --> 00:39:21,870
that I, there is an art form to
searching for things true. And

621
00:39:21,900 --> 00:39:27,150
you like I see it every day with
text, you know, tech support as

622
00:39:27,150 --> 00:39:32,040
part of my job. And as I see it
every day of people that just

623
00:39:32,040 --> 00:39:37,290
don't understand the art of
search. And so since you know

624
00:39:37,290 --> 00:39:40,830
that when you go to Google for
something, some of that I can

625
00:39:40,830 --> 00:39:44,850
Google for it and find something
in 15 seconds, right? Whereas

626
00:39:44,850 --> 00:39:48,720
somebody who's not used to the
way that search is supposed to

627
00:39:48,720 --> 00:39:52,680
work, can they can spend hours
and not find what they need.

628
00:39:52,710 --> 00:39:56,160
So I think our surfing search is
not Boolean. Oh, right.

629
00:39:56,609 --> 00:40:00,299
No, it is not Boolean right now.
Okay. But I think we're Really

630
00:40:00,299 --> 00:40:04,169
what it what the discussion
needs to revolve around. And

631
00:40:04,169 --> 00:40:06,359
this is what I was trying to get
at is that I don't I don't think

632
00:40:06,359 --> 00:40:09,959
I'm a good candidate to tell you
how good the search is because I

633
00:40:09,959 --> 00:40:13,679
kind of know how it works. But I
think the open discussion needs

634
00:40:13,679 --> 00:40:18,629
to be, which pieces of metadata
get indexed, and become

635
00:40:18,629 --> 00:40:22,259
searchable? Because I think that
really dictates the whole thing.

636
00:40:22,649 --> 00:40:25,499
Because at first what we were
doing is we were indexing,

637
00:40:26,129 --> 00:40:30,929
podcast title, a description
field, and it was getting

638
00:40:30,929 --> 00:40:34,439
everything in the world, right.
But we backed that off to just

639
00:40:34,439 --> 00:40:41,549
title. iTunes, owner name tag.
There's about three pieces of

640
00:40:41,549 --> 00:40:45,269
data that we're indexing and
what what that helped was now

641
00:40:45,269 --> 00:40:48,299
you can type in like New York
Times, and you can get all the

642
00:40:48,299 --> 00:40:50,609
New York Times podcast, but you
don't get everybody who

643
00:40:50,609 --> 00:40:53,519
references New York Times in
their description field. Right.

644
00:40:54,299 --> 00:40:57,479
So I think it's pretty good. But
I think it can get better if

645
00:40:57,479 --> 00:41:02,099
people just want to pipe up and
give us advice. Yeah, yeah.

646
00:41:02,130 --> 00:41:05,340
Because I've seen some searches
where it does spit back just too

647
00:41:05,340 --> 00:41:07,530
much. You know, I really liked
just getting the show. Yeah,

648
00:41:07,710 --> 00:41:10,650
Episode search. I mean, it's
something that is, I'm totally

649
00:41:10,650 --> 00:41:13,530
open to, but I've never used an
episode search. It's just not

650
00:41:13,530 --> 00:41:17,160
how, how I think about when I'm
looking for a podcast, like, can

651
00:41:17,160 --> 00:41:19,200
I find there's over 30 million?
Yeah,

652
00:41:19,259 --> 00:41:23,129
exactly, exactly. I think that's
the direction Apple wants to go

653
00:41:23,129 --> 00:41:27,029
with transcriptions and the
transcribing some stuff for some

654
00:41:27,029 --> 00:41:32,759
podcasts and hosts files for
some hosts and stuff. So they're

655
00:41:32,759 --> 00:41:34,439
doing something about it, and
they hired some kind of

656
00:41:34,439 --> 00:41:35,069
executive.

657
00:41:35,760 --> 00:41:38,430
I just don't see that being
being useful at all.

658
00:41:38,520 --> 00:41:40,110
What do you see as being most
useful?

659
00:41:40,950 --> 00:41:45,720
Well, you know, I think it's
really just tart is targeted mid

660
00:41:45,750 --> 00:41:51,090
metadata. Or maybe the other
idea that you could come at

661
00:41:51,090 --> 00:41:58,290
would be just denote a stop word
list is? Hmm, maybe. Okay. So

662
00:41:58,290 --> 00:42:02,280
like, if you're Google, or us,
or you're doing some sort of

663
00:42:02,760 --> 00:42:08,130
search algorithm, you want to
have a humongous list of words

664
00:42:08,370 --> 00:42:12,930
that just don't register. So you
want to have like, like the, and

665
00:42:12,990 --> 00:42:17,640
as, yeah, of course, you want to
say, I don't ever want to even

666
00:42:17,640 --> 00:42:20,430
touch I don't want to index
these words at all. Right? The

667
00:42:20,430 --> 00:42:23,250
better the better. The search,
usually, the bigger their stop

668
00:42:23,250 --> 00:42:27,570
word list is. And so me your
stop word list can be, you know,

669
00:42:27,600 --> 00:42:31,980
100,000 words or more right, of
things that just are polluting

670
00:42:31,980 --> 00:42:35,490
to they pollute your index and
don't help. Right. So I think, I

671
00:42:35,490 --> 00:42:40,650
think the way I would the way
I've envisioned it in my mind is

672
00:42:40,650 --> 00:42:45,990
that eventually, we will have a
very large stop word list. And

673
00:42:45,990 --> 00:42:52,470
we will begin to index does the
Description field but where the

674
00:42:52,470 --> 00:42:56,430
stop word list will be robust
enough to cut the noise out?

675
00:42:56,910 --> 00:42:59,910
Because when you because that
brings in some cool stuff, like

676
00:42:59,910 --> 00:43:03,630
people's names? Yeah. You know,
things like if you're looking

677
00:43:03,630 --> 00:43:06,750
for some somebody's name that
you wanted to see, they maybe

678
00:43:06,750 --> 00:43:09,630
had an somebody interviewed this
person, and I've got a unique

679
00:43:09,630 --> 00:43:14,220
name that would bring that in. I
kind of see it go in there. But

680
00:43:14,670 --> 00:43:19,080
I really do think that this is a
place where people can can

681
00:43:19,080 --> 00:43:19,740
really help.

682
00:43:21,450 --> 00:43:25,110
It's interesting. I was just
asked to review and comment on

683
00:43:25,110 --> 00:43:29,730
an academic book about
podcasting. Oh, really? Yeah.

684
00:43:29,760 --> 00:43:34,800
And well, actually was, we are
with my book as in final edits.

685
00:43:35,460 --> 00:43:38,940
Would you please would you mind
answering some questions? And

686
00:43:38,940 --> 00:43:41,940
now I want to read your book
first buyers to get permission

687
00:43:41,940 --> 00:43:45,720
from the publisher it's that
Okay, finally got it. It's so

688
00:43:45,720 --> 00:43:53,490
sad to see how the it's a
perfect overview of commercial

689
00:43:53,490 --> 00:43:57,240
radio going back to Tesla going
back to Faraday actually, so the

690
00:43:57,330 --> 00:44:05,760
way too much history about radio
am FM very abbreviated history

691
00:44:05,790 --> 00:44:09,240
of podcasting, but all along
it's all about the commercial

692
00:44:09,240 --> 00:44:12,000
aspect and who owned the
stations and and what

693
00:44:12,000 --> 00:44:15,390
advertisers and how can your
business it's, you know, it's an

694
00:44:15,390 --> 00:44:20,730
academic book, but it just seems
it's all coordinated around how

695
00:44:20,730 --> 00:44:27,000
do I make money which is kind of
sad because and I think this is

696
00:44:27,000 --> 00:44:30,540
where we where we can shine or
people who connect with our

697
00:44:30,540 --> 00:44:35,190
index and work on great new
experiences, great new ideas,

698
00:44:35,340 --> 00:44:39,180
because there's so much out
there so many other ways to in

699
00:44:39,180 --> 00:44:41,790
fact, this what we're doing here
the whole thing is value for

700
00:44:41,790 --> 00:44:44,910
value. All we ask is that you
support us with your time, your

701
00:44:44,910 --> 00:44:48,330
talent, your treasure, whatever
you can. We've got a PayPal link

702
00:44:49,020 --> 00:44:52,860
on the on the developer page on
the homepage. I'm working on my

703
00:44:52,860 --> 00:44:54,210
Bitpay a server.

704
00:44:55,470 --> 00:44:56,610
Oh, did you get it? Oh,

705
00:44:56,610 --> 00:44:58,170
yeah. Yeah. Oh, yeah.

706
00:44:58,169 --> 00:44:59,579
You sent me a screenshot. That's
right. Yeah.

707
00:44:59,580 --> 00:45:03,030
I need you to connect to my
lightning node. So we can, we

708
00:45:03,030 --> 00:45:06,030
can, yeah. Cool. See if we can
pass stuff back and forth.

709
00:45:06,060 --> 00:45:09,060
Yeah. We ever figured out if
cash at this cash app, do

710
00:45:09,060 --> 00:45:11,820
lightning, do it for you that
yeah, they do like an API. They

711
00:45:11,820 --> 00:45:13,410
didn't. Okay. Yeah, I'll send
you some money.

712
00:45:13,980 --> 00:45:17,340
Yes, send me some money. But
those of you who want to support

713
00:45:17,340 --> 00:45:19,530
the project, we got it. It was
really great. We got a couple

714
00:45:19,530 --> 00:45:23,220
$1,000 Since the launch, which
is fantastic. How are we doing,

715
00:45:23,220 --> 00:45:27,630
by the way on? On the server
situation? I know you spun up a

716
00:45:27,630 --> 00:45:31,020
couple more things. And yeah,
what's the view?

717
00:45:31,470 --> 00:45:36,630
Yes, it's gonna it's gonna die.
We're about $250 a month at the

718
00:45:36,630 --> 00:45:40,590
moment. And I think cool. So
settle out somewhere between

719
00:45:40,590 --> 00:45:44,610
that is somewhere south of three
300 is what I expect. And I

720
00:45:44,610 --> 00:45:48,000
think that'll be fine for a
while. Hopefully, that'll

721
00:45:48,090 --> 00:45:48,600
that'll keep

722
00:45:48,810 --> 00:45:52,530
that scales up is that something
that Cloudflare then handles a

723
00:45:52,530 --> 00:45:53,610
lot for or

724
00:45:54,060 --> 00:45:56,610
with Cloudflare has been helping
out a lot, just having them in

725
00:45:56,610 --> 00:45:59,160
front of us. Yeah, that has
helped a lot. Just taking some

726
00:45:59,160 --> 00:46:02,040
of that net cash heat off of us.
The one, the one thing we

727
00:46:02,040 --> 00:46:05,040
really, that we do need help
with? And this is something that

728
00:46:05,040 --> 00:46:08,640
I just don't have any experience
with? It's one of those things

729
00:46:08,640 --> 00:46:12,420
that I know, I know about, but
I've never implemented is rate

730
00:46:12,420 --> 00:46:16,260
limiting. And because you can do
it at a few different levels. If

731
00:46:16,260 --> 00:46:19,560
we do it at the Cloudflare
level, it's going to cost a lot

732
00:46:19,560 --> 00:46:24,450
of money. It is unpredictable.
Yeah. Or we don't know none. And

733
00:46:24,480 --> 00:46:29,130
we don't want that. And so what
we can do it at the nginx level,

734
00:46:30,210 --> 00:46:34,710
or at the app level. And I
probably preferred at the nginx

735
00:46:34,710 --> 00:46:38,730
level. And so if anybody has,
I'm going to, I'm going to be

736
00:46:38,730 --> 00:46:43,290
digging into that soon. But if
anybody has advice on, or sample

737
00:46:43,290 --> 00:46:46,530
configs, or anything like that
they can send that would also be

738
00:46:46,530 --> 00:46:49,710
very helpful and valuable. But
that's something we need just as

739
00:46:49,710 --> 00:46:52,890
a fallback just to keep people
from, you know, hammering this,

740
00:46:52,920 --> 00:46:54,840
this system and taking it down
by accident.

741
00:46:55,770 --> 00:46:58,260
Yeah, cuz I think accident would
be the only way you can really

742
00:46:58,260 --> 00:47:00,330
hurt us. I don't see many other
ways.

743
00:47:00,960 --> 00:47:05,730
Yeah, I mean, I don't, I don't
really care about. I think it's

744
00:47:05,730 --> 00:47:08,010
really just somebody that
doesn't know that they're

745
00:47:08,010 --> 00:47:11,010
hitting us too hard. I'm not
overly concerned about somebody

746
00:47:11,010 --> 00:47:13,500
who's doing something
legitimate. I think we can

747
00:47:13,500 --> 00:47:14,100
handle that.

748
00:47:14,279 --> 00:47:18,119
Yeah. What else do you need?

749
00:47:21,960 --> 00:47:26,190
Not a whole lot. I mean,
there's, we're getting such

750
00:47:26,220 --> 00:47:30,600
support from, you know, from
people, I needed help with a

751
00:47:30,600 --> 00:47:32,070
course config on Nginx.

752
00:47:32,580 --> 00:47:36,180
Can you explain to me what that
is? Because I looked at what is

753
00:47:36,180 --> 00:47:38,700
this course thing? I've heard of
it? I know it has something to

754
00:47:38,700 --> 00:47:40,620
do with a browser, but I'm not
quite sure.

755
00:47:40,950 --> 00:47:45,270
Yes. CRS is cross origin. I
think it's resource sharing,

756
00:47:45,360 --> 00:47:48,000
cross origin resource sharing,

757
00:47:48,030 --> 00:47:51,810
oh, is this a security thing
that comes into play? Yeah.

758
00:47:51,810 --> 00:47:56,790
So by a by design, web browsers,
JavaScript running in a web

759
00:47:56,790 --> 00:48:02,010
browser, is subject to the same
origin policy. So it cannot

760
00:48:02,490 --> 00:48:05,520
communicate with anything except
the domain that it was served

761
00:48:05,520 --> 00:48:06,030
from.

762
00:48:07,800 --> 00:48:11,370
And so unless you have a course
policy that allows it, is that

763
00:48:11,400 --> 00:48:12,240
is that how it works?

764
00:48:12,240 --> 00:48:16,590
Yeah, exactly. So we would have
to allow, we had to set up on

765
00:48:16,590 --> 00:48:20,070
our server, which we've done
now, to allow other dumb

766
00:48:20,100 --> 00:48:22,470
JavaScript reading mains to hit
us.

767
00:48:22,500 --> 00:48:25,470
I've seen this on the AWS
bucket, probably. That's where

768
00:48:25,470 --> 00:48:27,870
I've seen Oh, yeah. Before.
Okay, so I understand this. I

769
00:48:27,870 --> 00:48:29,760
got it. I got it. And so that's
working now.

770
00:48:30,150 --> 00:48:33,570
Yeah. Yes. Working on it. The
only you know, of course, your

771
00:48:33,600 --> 00:48:37,230
your risk there is that you open
yourself up to a denial service

772
00:48:37,230 --> 00:48:41,820
tech. But, you know, we got
cloud for flare. So yeah,

773
00:48:41,850 --> 00:48:44,220
hopefully that should that
should mitigate it. We'll

774
00:48:44,220 --> 00:48:46,230
bring that into play if
necessary. So what

775
00:48:46,230 --> 00:48:48,660
do you think is coming up in the
well, you got a week and you've

776
00:48:48,660 --> 00:48:51,240
had I know you've had a long
week, you've been working?

777
00:48:51,420 --> 00:48:54,810
Really I seen what you've been
doing on on the index. I know

778
00:48:54,810 --> 00:48:58,020
you also been doing your regular
job. What do you see is as as

779
00:48:58,020 --> 00:49:02,370
the timeline, where are we at
what's just what is your feel?

780
00:49:03,030 --> 00:49:05,460
I feel really good about things.
I mean, I feel good about where

781
00:49:05,460 --> 00:49:09,150
we're at so far with the
category thing is a big hurdle.

782
00:49:10,200 --> 00:49:18,690
Once we get that working well.
Then I think, really the next

783
00:49:20,190 --> 00:49:22,620
the next focus for me is going
to be to stop and do some

784
00:49:22,680 --> 00:49:28,200
infrastructure work. I need to
slow down and make sure

785
00:49:28,200 --> 00:49:33,120
everything's documented and make
sure we all have our backup

786
00:49:33,120 --> 00:49:35,070
procedures and everything to
make sure that all that's

787
00:49:35,100 --> 00:49:38,880
looking good. Just you have to
stop every now and then to just

788
00:49:38,880 --> 00:49:42,090
double check that stuff. And
then it's and then next after

789
00:49:42,090 --> 00:49:47,730
that is really just going to be
shifting gears because here's an

790
00:49:47,730 --> 00:49:51,630
here's an idea I've gotten and I
want to I want to I think I

791
00:49:51,630 --> 00:49:56,550
mentioned this to you the other
day is is splitting, splitting

792
00:49:56,550 --> 00:50:02,550
the API in a sense, okay, so
what you had have in my mind is

793
00:50:03,600 --> 00:50:07,140
you would have the API as it
stands now, which is for

794
00:50:07,140 --> 00:50:11,850
interacting with the index,
which would be adding feeds.

795
00:50:13,889 --> 00:50:16,949
complex query, adding retrieving
queries, yeah.

796
00:50:17,309 --> 00:50:20,279
Yeah, accomplished. Yeah,
complex searches, things like

797
00:50:20,279 --> 00:50:25,409
that. But then you would have,
we would have this other thing.

798
00:50:25,559 --> 00:50:32,789
Okay. And so the, it would be
two object storage repositories.

799
00:50:33,149 --> 00:50:38,759
So basically, it would be like
miniature versions of s3. And

800
00:50:38,759 --> 00:50:41,969
you can run that with a thing
called min IO. Have you ever

801
00:50:41,969 --> 00:50:42,449
heard of that?

802
00:50:42,510 --> 00:50:45,510
Well, I saw you post about it
for the image server. So that's,

803
00:50:45,870 --> 00:50:48,450
what is it like just a little
thing that does almost like an

804
00:50:48,450 --> 00:50:50,100
application specific server?

805
00:50:50,640 --> 00:50:54,030
Yeah, it's a it's like a binary
in a bucket. Okay, gotcha. Yep.

806
00:50:54,570 --> 00:50:57,990
It's compatible with the s3
protocol. It's, it's completely

807
00:50:57,990 --> 00:50:59,880
it's completely self contained.
It's

808
00:50:59,880 --> 00:51:02,010
much cheaper. Let me guess.
Free.

809
00:51:04,350 --> 00:51:07,110
Which, which perfectly fits our
lack of money? Yes.

810
00:51:08,610 --> 00:51:11,310
This is fits within the business
model. Very good.

811
00:51:11,430 --> 00:51:17,220
Yeah. The Venn diagram between
them and 100% overlap.

812
00:51:17,490 --> 00:51:18,570
That's one big circle.

813
00:51:18,750 --> 00:51:24,510
Yes. Yeah. So so the, the minio
server, we can spin, we can spin

814
00:51:24,510 --> 00:51:29,610
those up. They're lightweight.
And then you basically it, it

815
00:51:29,610 --> 00:51:36,240
takes a folder on your, on your
Linux box, and turns it into the

816
00:51:36,240 --> 00:51:40,290
bucket. So when you add them,
they just show up.

817
00:51:40,770 --> 00:51:44,100
You know, this is the thing.
Dave Weiner was trying to make

818
00:51:44,100 --> 00:51:49,290
happen. Man, this has got to be
almost 20 years ago, he had

819
00:51:49,290 --> 00:51:52,470
this, he called it the
upstreaming folder. And he had a

820
00:51:52,470 --> 00:51:55,470
little radar to this. Yeah, he
had a little radio userland,

821
00:51:55,470 --> 00:51:58,170
which was his app, which is
basically you access it through

822
00:51:58,170 --> 00:52:03,210
a web browser going through Port
5337. locally. And so you so

823
00:52:03,210 --> 00:52:06,240
you, the app was just in the
background, well, you know, kind

824
00:52:06,240 --> 00:52:08,970
of his whole, it was like a
scaled down version of frontier,

825
00:52:09,420 --> 00:52:12,480
any any had this application
that would create a folder on

826
00:52:12,480 --> 00:52:16,590
your desktop, and whatever yours
whatever your server settings,

827
00:52:16,590 --> 00:52:21,090
were, I think at the time was
probably FTP for most of it, you

828
00:52:21,090 --> 00:52:25,110
just drop, drop it in there, and
then it would appear and would

829
00:52:25,110 --> 00:52:28,350
be in the cloud. Or on your
server. It's the same, it's the

830
00:52:28,350 --> 00:52:31,800
same system, which is, I think,
the original kind of Dropbox

831
00:52:31,800 --> 00:52:32,310
idea.

832
00:52:33,180 --> 00:52:37,050
Oh, is that it? Was that all
running on on the RPC cloud?

833
00:52:38,010 --> 00:52:38,970
Type protocol?

834
00:52:39,000 --> 00:52:43,050
Didn't know it, then? No, I
think that no, well, maybe

835
00:52:43,050 --> 00:52:45,780
later, but not in the beginning.
But anyway, so I understand what

836
00:52:45,780 --> 00:52:46,800
min IO does.

837
00:52:46,980 --> 00:52:52,890
Yeah, so. So we, here so here's,
here's the, here's the scope,

838
00:52:52,890 --> 00:52:59,430
here are the the vision, we have
two min IO servers. One is

839
00:52:59,430 --> 00:53:03,570
called feeds dot podcast.
index.org. The other one is

840
00:53:03,810 --> 00:53:06,780
images dot podcast index, the
index Oh, I feel

841
00:53:06,780 --> 00:53:10,290
you, I feel you. And you can
just mount you can just mount

842
00:53:10,290 --> 00:53:12,870
that shit from any computer in
the world, and you've got all

843
00:53:12,870 --> 00:53:13,680
that shit in there.

844
00:53:13,950 --> 00:53:17,820
Files. You don't you don't even
need to hit the API. You don't

845
00:53:17,820 --> 00:53:21,900
need to hit the API. You just if
you have if you know the feeds

846
00:53:21,900 --> 00:53:27,180
ID, you just say you just make a
GET request to feeds dot podcast

847
00:53:27,180 --> 00:53:35,100
index.org/the Feed ID slash, you
know, the, the metadata file

848
00:53:35,100 --> 00:53:37,290
name, whatever we're going to
call it and you just made this

849
00:53:37,290 --> 00:53:42,660
decision. It's the equivalent of
calling the Get get feed by the

850
00:53:42,690 --> 00:53:43,080
API.

851
00:53:43,560 --> 00:53:48,720
except zero strain on the
database. Exactly. Oh, yeah.

852
00:53:48,750 --> 00:53:49,170
Like

853
00:53:49,200 --> 00:53:52,200
we're, we're constantly and we
would be constantly putting

854
00:53:52,200 --> 00:53:56,100
those feeds out there. So
anybody can get a well, you

855
00:53:56,100 --> 00:53:59,670
know what? Okay, I know where
you're going. Dave Jones, you're

856
00:53:59,670 --> 00:54:01,830
not fooling me. I know what's
next.

857
00:54:03,660 --> 00:54:07,530
Maybe I don't know what's next.
You film you reverse told me?

858
00:54:08,040 --> 00:54:15,090
IPFS? Yeah. Oh, yeah. Yeah.
Yeah, it's obvious. IPFS is

859
00:54:15,090 --> 00:54:16,290
perfect for that.

860
00:54:16,440 --> 00:54:19,590
Because then you have the was it
the IP NS the name system and

861
00:54:21,150 --> 00:54:26,040
people were my IPFS people were
my IPFS boys and girls.

862
00:54:26,340 --> 00:54:31,470
Yeah, we need the app PNS stuff
pointing to the object stores.

863
00:54:32,010 --> 00:54:35,250
It's just like, completely
static and it never changes.

864
00:54:35,790 --> 00:54:39,600
And, and then, okay, so it's the
same thing on the image side,

865
00:54:39,600 --> 00:54:41,970
because James was talking about
this the other day, he was

866
00:54:41,970 --> 00:54:46,200
saying, he said, you know, he
had two problems. He's like, I'm

867
00:54:46,200 --> 00:54:50,160
uncomfortable. Just loading
random images off the Alpha

868
00:54:50,160 --> 00:54:51,600
million places on the internet.

869
00:54:51,629 --> 00:54:55,019
Yes, that's that's a very valid
point. Because you don't know

870
00:54:55,019 --> 00:54:57,659
what's going to show up. I'm
sure it's true. A lot of people

871
00:54:57,659 --> 00:55:01,199
are like, oh, man, let me Put
some cooling there.

872
00:55:01,440 --> 00:55:05,760
Yeah, exactly. So he's like, I
got that problem. And I've also

873
00:55:05,760 --> 00:55:07,950
got the fact that when you do
that is slow.

874
00:55:08,610 --> 00:55:11,220
Because you're coming, you're
coming from God knows where,

875
00:55:11,490 --> 00:55:15,360
yeah, a million places. It's
like if you load up an html5

876
00:55:15,360 --> 00:55:18,780
podcast app, and you're, you're
loading 25 podcasts on the

877
00:55:18,780 --> 00:55:20,940
screen at once, and they're
coming from all these different

878
00:55:20,940 --> 00:55:23,430
language locations, you can see
it in the search. Now on our

879
00:55:23,430 --> 00:55:25,590
page, it loads slow sometimes,

880
00:55:26,040 --> 00:55:29,430
yes, because of the images. And
right now, because of something

881
00:55:29,430 --> 00:55:33,360
we changed. Even though I truly
interesting, you know, I

882
00:55:33,360 --> 00:55:37,410
published a whole new feed, no
aggregator I know of has picked

883
00:55:37,410 --> 00:55:40,860
up the the changes to the images
in the entire feed only for the

884
00:55:40,860 --> 00:55:45,180
new episodes, that changed the
URL, as you know. So all the

885
00:55:45,180 --> 00:55:47,940
aggregators only, of course,
look at the first one, but

886
00:55:47,940 --> 00:55:51,360
here's the conundrum, or the new
items, and they get the images

887
00:55:51,360 --> 00:55:55,500
correctly. So for instance, now,
the image for this podcast will

888
00:55:55,500 --> 00:55:59,100
show up in the index, because
even though I changed the feed,

889
00:55:59,910 --> 00:56:03,180
the aggregator just has the old
stuff in there, the only way I

890
00:56:03,180 --> 00:56:07,050
think to do it, is to change the
geo ID or the published date for

891
00:56:07,050 --> 00:56:10,230
each individual item, which
could probably trigger a huge

892
00:56:10,230 --> 00:56:14,370
read download of hundreds of
1000s of apps. Totally Well,

893
00:56:14,370 --> 00:56:18,720
that's why I don't do it's
actually a flaw in the system to

894
00:56:18,720 --> 00:56:20,490
fly to Florida system,

895
00:56:20,850 --> 00:56:24,090
and see if that saved me the
search for you in the index. I

896
00:56:24,090 --> 00:56:25,050
think we picked you up.

897
00:56:25,530 --> 00:56:28,470
Now. You're in there, but I
think

898
00:56:30,120 --> 00:56:31,230
now we get your data.

899
00:56:31,740 --> 00:56:34,500
But if you do if you do
podcasting 2.0

900
00:56:36,180 --> 00:56:38,460
Is it still it cuz it hasn't
updated yet? Right? Yeah, cuz I

901
00:56:38,460 --> 00:56:38,730
haven't

902
00:56:38,730 --> 00:56:41,940
updated the feed, even though
the images are correct in the

903
00:56:41,940 --> 00:56:45,390
feed. But yeah, I was like I've
learned over the years. A bad

904
00:56:45,390 --> 00:56:50,190
idea. Especially with no agenda
where we have a lot of we push a

905
00:56:50,190 --> 00:56:54,150
tariff, we get max at a terabyte
per second. When I when I

906
00:56:54,150 --> 00:56:58,500
correct Oh, yeah. Now that only
lasts for I think, I want to say

907
00:56:58,500 --> 00:57:00,960
10 minutes, and then they
throttle it down.

908
00:57:01,350 --> 00:57:04,200
See, that's what you are. That's
why y'all you're the exception

909
00:57:04,290 --> 00:57:04,470
is

910
00:57:05,160 --> 00:57:07,950
unbelievable. So you know, when
I fuck up something in the feed,

911
00:57:07,950 --> 00:57:13,110
which I have done. It causes
massive, massive problems.

912
00:57:13,440 --> 00:57:20,610
Mainly people emailing me
saying, What is this? It doesn't

913
00:57:20,610 --> 00:57:23,340
work. I can't find it. Where's
the file? iTunes doesn't like

914
00:57:23,340 --> 00:57:26,070
it. It's not on Google Play.
Stitcher is no, it's like, it

915
00:57:26,070 --> 00:57:29,550
goes on forever, even to
republish, it's just it's a bad

916
00:57:29,550 --> 00:57:30,060
idea.

917
00:57:30,390 --> 00:57:32,790
How many times do you double
check and eyeball that feed

918
00:57:32,790 --> 00:57:36,450
before you hit before you push
it? Not enough? Not enough?

919
00:57:36,540 --> 00:57:40,290
Not enough? No. This was still
way too much manual work in

920
00:57:40,290 --> 00:57:43,560
there. It's and it's Yeah,
thanks. It's like, episode

921
00:57:43,560 --> 00:57:48,270
number off by one, you know, or
I've just know, there's a lot

922
00:57:48,270 --> 00:57:51,360
more I should and could
automate. And but it's just now

923
00:57:51,360 --> 00:57:56,340
I have this whole checklist. And
even then, you know, if I let's

924
00:57:56,340 --> 00:58:00,600
put it this way, if it were if
it was preflight for and I was

925
00:58:00,600 --> 00:58:03,330
flying, I probably would have
been dead by now. I've made so

926
00:58:03,330 --> 00:58:05,730
many mistakes. So many mistakes.

927
00:58:06,000 --> 00:58:08,970
Yeah. Yeah. The runway and

928
00:58:09,540 --> 00:58:14,280
silly that shit. Right. In the
in the river. Right. Yeah.

929
00:58:16,260 --> 00:58:19,710
Anyway, that I'm really excited
about that. That I think is a

930
00:58:19,710 --> 00:58:23,730
fantastic idea. And this is part
of the mission. And a lot of

931
00:58:23,730 --> 00:58:26,340
people saying, well, well
distributed well, here is the

932
00:58:26,340 --> 00:58:31,500
opportunity, we can distribute
the actual feeds. Interplanetary

933
00:58:31,500 --> 00:58:34,530
wide. And that's sure there's
many other ways to do it. With

934
00:58:34,530 --> 00:58:37,980
IPFS, such as, I think IPFS is
waiting for this.

935
00:58:39,030 --> 00:58:42,480
I think so too. I think this is
a great use case for it. Like,

936
00:58:42,690 --> 00:58:48,510
and I like the the image thing.
It was like dead simple. I mean,

937
00:58:48,510 --> 00:58:51,240
we wrote, James mentioned that,
I think, and we wrote that in

938
00:58:51,240 --> 00:58:54,360
like a day. Right? It was like
it was I mean, that's, that's,

939
00:58:54,540 --> 00:58:57,780
it's working. So I mean, it
pulls every you know, when a

940
00:58:57,840 --> 00:59:03,030
when a feed hits, it pulls, it
automatically pulls the image

941
00:59:03,030 --> 00:59:05,310
and resizes it into four
different resolutions and sticks

942
00:59:05,310 --> 00:59:08,100
it in the object store. I mean,
like, it's beautiful. I'm not

943
00:59:08,100 --> 00:59:10,830
gonna, I'm not I haven't made it
live yet. Because I'm just going

944
00:59:10,830 --> 00:59:14,010
to make make. I don't want to
get too deep into that yet. But

945
00:59:14,010 --> 00:59:18,060
I think that is absolutely the
direction to go. And we push it

946
00:59:18,060 --> 00:59:22,500
through IPFS. And then we don't
even have to worry about about

947
00:59:22,500 --> 00:59:27,000
those calls hitting the index. I
mean, hitting the API. And so

948
00:59:27,000 --> 00:59:29,940
what and what we could even do
is just like when I when a, when

949
00:59:29,940 --> 00:59:35,160
an API request comes in to one
of those endpoints for a feed,

950
00:59:35,340 --> 00:59:39,480
we just redirect which 301 it
over to the object store. It's

951
00:59:39,480 --> 00:59:40,950
don't even pull out of the
database.

952
00:59:41,279 --> 00:59:44,369
I'm kind of jacked about this
because it's such an I didn't

953
00:59:44,369 --> 00:59:47,549
know we would get to this so
quickly. It's such a beautiful

954
00:59:47,549 --> 00:59:53,759
use case for IPFS high volume,
lots of changes, global in

955
00:59:53,759 --> 00:59:59,639
nature. Lots of people who can
contribute and seed I mean, this

956
00:59:59,879 --> 01:00:02,309
is tons of people can help see
if we need that.

957
01:00:03,000 --> 01:00:06,750
Yeah, we just see the hope. And
we can, we could just see the

958
01:00:06,750 --> 01:00:07,710
whole back end, you know,

959
01:00:08,460 --> 01:00:11,520
we need the pen or the pens, I
guess would be more accurate

960
01:00:11,520 --> 01:00:15,900
description, use a pin servers.
So we'd be a pin server. Okay.

961
01:00:17,220 --> 01:00:19,980
But you want to have as many as
possible, and then anybody can

962
01:00:19,980 --> 01:00:20,790
help with that.

963
01:00:21,330 --> 01:00:25,500
Yeah, I would love what I would
love is to have have the IP and

964
01:00:25,710 --> 01:00:32,220
IPFS stuff working. And then on
the HTTP side, have people are

965
01:00:32,220 --> 01:00:35,970
clone our server, you know, our
sink or server or whatever,

966
01:00:35,970 --> 01:00:39,030
whatever protocol, we figure out
for that. And then we just have

967
01:00:39,030 --> 01:00:42,180
multiple people that are running
copies of it exactly like for

968
01:00:42,180 --> 01:00:45,360
like for the image database. And
then we can just round robin the

969
01:00:45,360 --> 01:00:50,580
DNS. So that is coming from
somebody, so we just share the

970
01:00:50,580 --> 01:00:53,490
load. And that's another way
people can can share value.

971
01:00:54,510 --> 01:01:00,060
Well, you said it, we could
share the load, I'm going to

972
01:01:00,090 --> 01:01:03,360
give you the whole load today.
You're triggering that shit.

973
01:01:05,040 --> 01:01:07,650
At least once, at least, at
least once.

974
01:01:09,030 --> 01:01:13,350
Well, this, that that's a good,
a good, yeah, good spot to be I

975
01:01:13,350 --> 01:01:13,860
guess.

976
01:01:14,370 --> 01:01:19,230
Yeah. And, you know, I was
thinking, a lot of people, I

977
01:01:19,230 --> 01:01:26,550
guess the the natural question
is why? There's already some

978
01:01:26,580 --> 01:01:30,480
directories and stuff like that
out there. A what's the point?

979
01:01:31,050 --> 01:01:36,600
Why are you? Why are you doing
this? Again, so to speak, and

980
01:01:38,130 --> 01:01:46,140
that our sort of our vision for
this, obviously, is to preserve

981
01:01:46,380 --> 01:01:48,900
podcasting as a platform for
freedom of speech we want to

982
01:01:48,900 --> 01:01:54,120
make that's, that's, that's the
mission is to make where you're

983
01:01:54,180 --> 01:01:58,590
everybody is not dependent on
one single entity or entity,

984
01:01:58,620 --> 01:02:03,870
corporate player, we're business
to or an LLC. But basically,

985
01:02:03,870 --> 01:02:05,610
that's just because we have to
have some place to pay the

986
01:02:05,610 --> 01:02:12,720
bills. And so the but the real,
the real drive here, and the

987
01:02:12,720 --> 01:02:19,140
real aim is to make it where the
whole world of podcasting, which

988
01:02:19,140 --> 01:02:23,550
is, on the technical level is
chaos. And we've said this

989
01:02:23,550 --> 01:02:27,960
before, but I think we've maybe
not been super clear about it is

990
01:02:28,740 --> 01:02:33,780
for anybody to get into this
game, as a developer, or as we

991
01:02:33,780 --> 01:02:36,840
look at look at Amazon music,
for instance. It took them how

992
01:02:36,840 --> 01:02:41,550
long? Yeah, bring up their
system quite a while. Yeah, I

993
01:02:41,550 --> 01:02:45,330
mean, months of work, to bring
up their system, because they

994
01:02:45,330 --> 01:02:48,510
get to build aggregators, they
get to do all this jazz, to make

995
01:02:48,510 --> 01:02:51,180
sure everything is normalized,
they get data, it's a lot of

996
01:02:51,180 --> 01:02:52,740
work. And so

997
01:02:52,740 --> 01:02:54,840
you could have had a career Dave
Jones,

998
01:02:54,870 --> 01:03:01,320
yeah, I could have, instead of
being the back end guy for the

999
01:03:01,320 --> 01:03:05,160
no agenda show for two years.
And which is not lucrative.

1000
01:03:07,020 --> 01:03:08,910
You got one dinner out of it so
far.

1001
01:03:10,440 --> 01:03:16,500
I did. And creme brulee. Hey, it
was you remember the crem brew

1002
01:03:16,500 --> 01:03:22,020
lay crap. crimper lay? Forgot
what drink that was ahead is

1003
01:03:22,020 --> 01:03:22,530
like

1004
01:03:22,590 --> 01:03:26,280
do we got to fix is that where
we went? I don't, I actually

1005
01:03:27,090 --> 01:03:30,180
don't remember it was down sort
of like, is a few blocks away

1006
01:03:30,180 --> 01:03:32,790
from your house. And then it was
on sort of a main drag that was

1007
01:03:32,790 --> 01:03:36,000
going down a hill? I don't
remember. But then they had like

1008
01:03:36,000 --> 01:03:41,730
this. This drink. It was some
sort of like gin or something I

1009
01:03:41,730 --> 01:03:45,870
forget. But it had like
jalapenos and yah, yah, yah.

1010
01:03:46,050 --> 01:03:50,820
Yah, it was like, bathroom city
the next day that she had and

1011
01:03:50,820 --> 01:03:54,360
jalapenos. They go fast. They go
through

1012
01:03:55,080 --> 01:03:59,160
just renting him temporarily.
Yeah, excellent. Well, we'll

1013
01:03:59,160 --> 01:04:06,210
just on that for a second. Just
to reiterate this, I called you

1014
01:04:06,510 --> 01:04:10,890
and I said, Look, here's what I
see happening. I see. We're

1015
01:04:10,890 --> 01:04:14,070
going to have the same kind of
streaming wars where we have and

1016
01:04:14,070 --> 01:04:17,100
it's not really a war. But you
know, I know people make

1017
01:04:17,100 --> 01:04:19,560
documentaries they pick to pitch
them to Amazon, they pitch them

1018
01:04:19,560 --> 01:04:23,310
the Netflix and depending on
what's going on in their world

1019
01:04:23,310 --> 01:04:26,580
and their their corporate
mission, they either hot for it

1020
01:04:26,580 --> 01:04:29,580
or they're not hot for it. You
know and this is how you

1021
01:04:29,580 --> 01:04:32,010
eventually wind up with stuff
like cuties you know, there's

1022
01:04:32,010 --> 01:04:35,730
all kinds of stuff that that
goes wrong and or is just it's

1023
01:04:35,760 --> 01:04:39,180
it's about commercial interests
and stats and, and the art kind

1024
01:04:39,180 --> 01:04:42,120
of, in my opinion, the art kind
of gets lost and you end people

1025
01:04:42,120 --> 01:04:44,730
get locked out pushed down and
this was what happened

1026
01:04:44,730 --> 01:04:51,210
originally with with podcasting.
Is that the surfacing of the

1027
01:04:51,210 --> 01:04:54,480
shows and anyone who was round
and will remember the griping

1028
01:04:54,480 --> 01:04:58,830
and grunting and groaning it was
all NPR was the safe stuff and

1029
01:04:59,100 --> 01:05:02,880
in fact that it, as we both
talked about, the first thing

1030
01:05:02,880 --> 01:05:05,340
Kara Swisher pointed out when
she heard about podcasts or

1031
01:05:05,340 --> 01:05:10,020
Steve Jobs is how do we? How do
we tag that? You know if it's

1032
01:05:10,020 --> 01:05:14,370
bad or naughty or horrible
words, and that is it. So when

1033
01:05:14,370 --> 01:05:17,970
we say preserving podcasting as
a platform for free speech, that

1034
01:05:17,970 --> 01:05:22,050
is exactly what it's about. And
in order to do that

1035
01:05:22,080 --> 01:05:25,020
platform, yeah, that's the key
word. Yes. Yes.

1036
01:05:25,560 --> 01:05:28,770
Thank you and the planet, the
reserve the whole platform, not

1037
01:05:28,770 --> 01:05:33,300
just not just the podcasters not
Yes, it has to be everybody. And

1038
01:05:33,330 --> 01:05:37,530
and the group that never got the
chance, in my opinion, is the

1039
01:05:37,530 --> 01:05:42,450
podcast app developers, people
have players search people who

1040
01:05:42,450 --> 01:05:47,550
want to do charts, directories,
indexes, highlights, whatever it

1041
01:05:47,550 --> 01:05:51,180
is you want to do. That's what
we want to that's we want to

1042
01:05:51,180 --> 01:05:55,140
serve, and moving this to an
interplant. That's what IPFS

1043
01:05:55,140 --> 01:05:59,130
stands for people who don't know
interplanetary file system. Were

1044
01:05:59,130 --> 01:06:04,320
truly, it's just it's global
distribution in nature, you

1045
01:06:04,320 --> 01:06:07,980
really can't take stuff down at
a certain point, it's just out

1046
01:06:07,980 --> 01:06:14,670
there. And from our perspective,
we might get lucky. And we'll

1047
01:06:14,670 --> 01:06:17,010
say, Oh, here's something that
we can do that will provide

1048
01:06:17,040 --> 01:06:21,780
added value to the platform. But
we realize there's no platform.

1049
01:06:22,020 --> 01:06:24,450
So that's what we're building.
And the platform has been that

1050
01:06:24,450 --> 01:06:27,150
we have 50 people in the Macedon
only how many are actually

1051
01:06:27,150 --> 01:06:29,820
developers, but I consider
everyone to be developing one

1052
01:06:29,820 --> 01:06:33,900
way or the other end, the
contributions will benefit

1053
01:06:34,050 --> 01:06:37,920
everybody, and everybody will be
able to create whatever they

1054
01:06:37,920 --> 01:06:44,310
want. And we'll see where it
goes. That's the 2.0 part. And

1055
01:06:44,310 --> 01:06:48,450
there's live lots of ideas. And
you have ideas, and I see people

1056
01:06:48,450 --> 01:06:51,930
coming up with great, great
questions and thoughts. Once we

1057
01:06:51,930 --> 01:06:54,480
get this part done. It should be
easy.

1058
01:06:54,540 --> 01:07:00,420
I think that's the other. Maybe
the other issue is, is that I

1059
01:07:00,420 --> 01:07:04,380
remember reading a while a while
back, I forget how long ago this

1060
01:07:04,380 --> 01:07:06,600
was or even what it was about.
But it was a guy talking about a

1061
01:07:06,600 --> 01:07:08,850
product that he had made. And it
ended up being mildly

1062
01:07:08,850 --> 01:07:15,960
successful. And just to
interject, though, we, for us

1063
01:07:15,990 --> 01:07:19,590
success doesn't mean that we
make more money, success

1064
01:07:19,590 --> 01:07:23,010
probably means that money gets
tighter, because the bills go

1065
01:07:23,010 --> 01:07:28,620
up. So do my job. Yeah, exactly.
So when I say success, I just

1066
01:07:28,620 --> 01:07:33,270
mean success in the mission. So
this guy was talking about how

1067
01:07:33,270 --> 01:07:37,410
he had built a product. It was a
web based thing. And he said, he

1068
01:07:37,410 --> 01:07:42,420
got into the mindset of how he
couldn't release the product.

1069
01:07:42,420 --> 01:07:47,700
Yeah, because he needed to add
this new feature. And well, he

1070
01:07:47,700 --> 01:07:49,950
would add that feature. And he
said, Okay, well, I can't Yeah,

1071
01:07:49,950 --> 01:07:52,530
but it's still not there yet. I
gotta add this other feature.

1072
01:07:52,560 --> 01:07:54,900
Yeah. And he just kept doing
this and doing this. And he made

1073
01:07:54,900 --> 01:07:57,870
this comment. And I will have
never forgotten that this is

1074
01:07:57,870 --> 01:08:02,940
private 10 years ago. He said,
there's never a time when not

1075
01:08:02,940 --> 01:08:06,570
having a product is better than
having a product. Yeah, I'm in

1076
01:08:06,570 --> 01:08:12,120
total agreement. So they, we,
we've opened up the podcast

1077
01:08:12,120 --> 01:08:19,470
index to people with a whole lot
of warts, and, and crappy user

1078
01:08:19,470 --> 01:08:25,290
interface, and all that stuff.
But the thing had to be it had

1079
01:08:25,290 --> 01:08:29,280
to live and it had to be out
there. And so all that stuff, no

1080
01:08:29,280 --> 01:08:33,720
categories, these things are
getting fixed on a weekly, daily

1081
01:08:33,720 --> 01:08:39,180
and weekly basis. And it is
getting better. And but at no

1082
01:08:39,180 --> 01:08:45,570
point was not having an open
source free index. Better than

1083
01:08:45,570 --> 01:08:50,250
having one. Even if it's not
complete and, and some sort of

1084
01:08:50,280 --> 01:08:52,950
amazingly shiny thing that'll
blow your socks off. I

1085
01:08:54,090 --> 01:08:57,600
totally agree. And I look
forward to the day which will

1086
01:08:57,600 --> 01:09:02,040
happen when I can look at a
smartphone screen. And yeah, I

1087
01:09:02,040 --> 01:09:08,130
may see Spotify, Apple, Amazon,
and I want to see 4040 other

1088
01:09:08,130 --> 01:09:12,960
apps that do all kinds of crazy
stuff with podcast. Yeah. And

1089
01:09:13,020 --> 01:09:15,600
they also because that that's
the competition, you know that

1090
01:09:15,660 --> 01:09:20,850
your competition is now one icon
on a, on a launch board from a

1091
01:09:20,850 --> 01:09:24,960
smartphone away. I mean, that's,
that's, and it's for anybody to

1092
01:09:24,960 --> 01:09:28,770
have. I mean, personally,
Spotify is interface is

1093
01:09:28,770 --> 01:09:33,210
atrocious. It doesn't start half
the time. It's you know, it's

1094
01:09:33,210 --> 01:09:36,480
confusing where the video is.
That's just their vision of it.

1095
01:09:36,600 --> 01:09:39,690
And they're so busy. Right now.
They've got all kinds of

1096
01:09:39,690 --> 01:09:45,450
problems with with rogue feeds,
etc. They're, you know, we know

1097
01:09:45,450 --> 01:09:46,440
what they're going through.

1098
01:09:47,430 --> 01:09:49,620
Like I saw so you sent me
something that day is like half

1099
01:09:49,620 --> 01:09:52,710
their guys are like walking out
in protest about Rogen or

1100
01:09:52,710 --> 01:09:53,160
something like

1101
01:09:53,370 --> 01:09:57,990
that, too. Yeah, yeah. Yeah.
Well, I mean, there's a there's

1102
01:09:57,990 --> 01:10:03,300
a lot of stuff going on and No
matter what happens with, with

1103
01:10:03,300 --> 01:10:07,050
Joe or any other show that may
be exclusive to someone, The

1104
01:10:07,050 --> 01:10:10,470
speculation is enough. And
that's what I've always said,

1105
01:10:10,470 --> 01:10:14,100
it's like when people know that
there's a walled garden, just

1106
01:10:14,100 --> 01:10:16,980
like America Online eventually
that like, you know, all you got

1107
01:10:16,980 --> 01:10:19,710
to do is get this one other app
or here's this web app called

1108
01:10:19,770 --> 01:10:23,880
now liquid I can get, I can get
everything I want. And if I want

1109
01:10:23,880 --> 01:10:28,050
to have, I want to do a podcast
tomorrow, and it consists of me

1110
01:10:28,050 --> 01:10:31,860
burping, and do an ASMR, and a
microphone, and I put and I put

1111
01:10:31,860 --> 01:10:36,780
it up through through blueberry,
or any other any other system,

1112
01:10:36,780 --> 01:10:41,370
it'll be in the index and
available immediately to however

1113
01:10:41,370 --> 01:10:44,040
many apps way before you get on
to Apple.

1114
01:10:44,909 --> 01:10:48,899
And that that's the thing is is
like, isn't that what we all

1115
01:10:48,899 --> 01:10:53,519
want is that is that if I add
something, let's you know, going

1116
01:10:53,519 --> 01:10:56,399
back to the what we talked about
at the beginning of this show of

1117
01:10:56,399 --> 01:11:02,369
this episode is like I think we
all want a system where if I add

1118
01:11:02,369 --> 01:11:06,629
to blue, add on blueberry, or if
I add on transistor, or if I add

1119
01:11:06,629 --> 01:11:09,929
on Lipson that it immediately
becomes available and all these

1120
01:11:09,929 --> 01:11:13,589
apps that we don't have to wait
for it to go through iTunes

1121
01:11:13,589 --> 01:11:18,449
review, or whatever they do. I
mean, like, I think we all want

1122
01:11:18,749 --> 01:11:22,529
that thing to happen. Because
that's a that is turning the

1123
01:11:22,529 --> 01:11:27,119
distributed world of podcasting
into its own platform that does

1124
01:11:27,119 --> 01:11:28,379
not depend on someone.

1125
01:11:29,400 --> 01:11:34,020
And this will, right now if you
have an idea for an audio book,

1126
01:11:34,530 --> 01:11:39,030
let's say you want to do
chapters, with with with an open

1127
01:11:39,030 --> 01:11:42,060
system and an open platform, you
can kind of do it however you

1128
01:11:42,060 --> 01:11:46,500
want. I guarantee you that
Amazon if you have an audio book

1129
01:11:46,500 --> 01:11:50,400
that you want to publish as a
podcast. I can't guarantee you

1130
01:11:50,400 --> 01:11:53,070
but I'm quite sure that
eventually if not immediately,

1131
01:11:53,070 --> 01:11:55,860
they will say not enough. You
belong over here in the audible

1132
01:11:55,860 --> 01:11:58,470
section. You don't belong in
podcasts, and they're going to

1133
01:11:58,470 --> 01:12:01,380
tell you what this is. My
problem with this academic book

1134
01:12:01,890 --> 01:12:06,750
is telling me what a podcast is
bullcrap. A podcast can be I

1135
01:12:06,750 --> 01:12:09,600
just subscribed to one that I
found in the index. I found that

1136
01:12:09,600 --> 01:12:13,620
on the carousel, it said
President Trump's speeches and

1137
01:12:13,620 --> 01:12:16,650
well that's handy. And really
and lo and behold

1138
01:12:16,650 --> 01:12:19,590
podcast of only the speeches.
Yeah, Trump

1139
01:12:19,620 --> 01:12:21,030
that is so interesting is

1140
01:12:23,070 --> 01:12:25,440
that should be that should it be
for every president.

1141
01:12:25,740 --> 01:12:31,680
Oh my god, it's it's actually
this has speeches by the First

1142
01:12:31,680 --> 01:12:37,320
Lady by President Trump.
Someone's also doing

1143
01:12:37,950 --> 01:12:41,820
Yeah, I'm looking at it right
now. In that cool. That is so

1144
01:12:41,820 --> 01:12:44,220
interesting, man. What? Like
that.

1145
01:12:44,460 --> 01:12:46,830
So that's what there's nothing
against that doesn't have to be

1146
01:12:46,830 --> 01:12:50,850
a show. That's a service that's
a public C span should be doing

1147
01:12:50,850 --> 01:12:55,770
this. Oh, yeah. I've already
said before, I think I know

1148
01:12:55,770 --> 01:12:59,040
agenda C span should do a
podcast feed which is called

1149
01:12:59,040 --> 01:13:03,270
that we call it podcast of the
callers with all the crazy

1150
01:13:03,270 --> 01:13:06,450
callers crazy callers, man,
that's that I would listen to

1151
01:13:06,450 --> 01:13:08,400
that every day. Just give me a
couple of those.

1152
01:13:08,790 --> 01:13:09,540
That'd be great.

1153
01:13:09,570 --> 01:13:14,280
I mean, the way I saw it the way
I envisioned it, original way

1154
01:13:14,280 --> 01:13:22,620
back in the day, even before pod
show slash medio was Why can't I

1155
01:13:22,620 --> 01:13:29,250
just have a weather report prop
up for my area code, or my city

1156
01:13:29,250 --> 01:13:33,210
or my state? Then every morning
when I when I go to look at

1157
01:13:33,210 --> 01:13:36,030
what's happening? What's new.
Oh, there's the weather report.

1158
01:13:36,360 --> 01:13:39,600
Now it's a silly example because
it's probably easier just look

1159
01:13:39,600 --> 01:13:42,000
at it on your phone and look at
the pretty sun and the and the

1160
01:13:42,000 --> 01:13:45,090
clouds. But there's a lot of
things that can be done like

1161
01:13:45,090 --> 01:13:45,540
that.

1162
01:13:46,680 --> 01:13:53,370
Oh, yeah. podcast I listened to
called storage center from the

1163
01:13:53,940 --> 01:13:57,060
internet storm, the internet
storm cast, that's what's called

1164
01:13:57,540 --> 01:13:59,670
for the guys that I've seen.
It's basically just a five

1165
01:13:59,670 --> 01:14:04,020
minute daily publishes every
morning, a five minute daily

1166
01:14:04,050 --> 01:14:07,320
review of the previous day's
cybersecurity news. And I have

1167
01:14:07,320 --> 01:14:09,630
to listen to it every day on my
way to work just to make sure

1168
01:14:09,630 --> 01:14:12,630
that I'm not missing anything.
So if you had lots of those

1169
01:14:12,630 --> 01:14:14,070
types of deals, you know, and

1170
01:14:14,370 --> 01:14:18,720
and I'd love for for a professor
to say okay, I hope you enjoyed

1171
01:14:18,720 --> 01:14:24,660
the lecture. It'll be on the
podcast in 10 minutes. I just

1172
01:14:24,660 --> 01:14:29,940
got to upload the mp3 and
Professor doesn't have to worry

1173
01:14:30,480 --> 01:14:35,280
about getting approval and going
through this whole process. I

1174
01:14:35,280 --> 01:14:38,790
mean, ultimately, if you want to
be listed through Apple but who

1175
01:14:38,790 --> 01:14:41,610
knows where they're going, I
mean Apple could could see the

1176
01:14:41,610 --> 01:14:44,430
writing on the wall. I mean,
Apple has also tried to compete

1177
01:14:44,430 --> 01:14:51,330
with Netflix with Apple TV plus,
you know, they have a creator

1178
01:14:51,330 --> 01:14:58,860
relations person, which sounds
like an illness. Creator create

1179
01:14:58,860 --> 01:15:01,830
I never liked this one. You
don't like that? Or no, I don't

1180
01:15:01,830 --> 01:15:06,390
know why it hurts me so bad. But
it's like, I'm a creator now,

1181
01:15:06,390 --> 01:15:07,920
man, or podcaster

1182
01:15:08,250 --> 01:15:10,950
does it bother you because it
implies that other people are

1183
01:15:10,950 --> 01:15:15,960
not creative? Is it because of
the exclusivity of it?

1184
01:15:16,410 --> 01:15:20,400
Honestly, it feels more like a
God thing to me, You are a

1185
01:15:20,400 --> 01:15:24,240
creator, I'm like, I'm doing a
podcast, I don't know, if I'm a

1186
01:15:24,240 --> 01:15:32,040
creator, it puts a false, it's
also a back to my example, a

1187
01:15:32,040 --> 01:15:38,940
university professor who puts
his you know, puts his stuff

1188
01:15:38,940 --> 01:15:43,980
online, and, you know, it can be
every, every session he does, or

1189
01:15:43,980 --> 01:15:47,940
every class or whatever it is.
It's not necessarily creators

1190
01:15:47,940 --> 01:15:51,480
professor who has a shit out
there and a podcast, you know,

1191
01:15:51,870 --> 01:15:55,380
it's it sets this false sense of
okay, here's, here's my problem,

1192
01:15:55,380 --> 01:15:58,380
I guess. And it's deep within
me, because I haven't really

1193
01:15:58,380 --> 01:16:04,200
thought about it. It sets the
tone of this has got to be

1194
01:16:04,200 --> 01:16:08,970
entertainment, this has to be a
show. Whereas I've never agreed

1195
01:16:08,970 --> 01:16:14,280
with that I've never had I've
used enclosures for PDFs. Now

1196
01:16:14,310 --> 01:16:18,690
that on me, I had reasons to do
it. Now, technically, there's no

1197
01:16:18,690 --> 01:16:21,360
reason you can't do that. Just
depends on what you're reading

1198
01:16:21,360 --> 01:16:26,580
it with. But the idea that a kid
can say I'm gonna do a podcast,

1199
01:16:26,880 --> 01:16:32,640
and within an hour can go to his
or her friends and say, hey, get

1200
01:16:32,640 --> 01:16:37,290
that app over there and search
for my podcast. That's you,

1201
01:16:37,290 --> 01:16:38,670
that's a big deal.

1202
01:16:39,870 --> 01:16:45,420
In that, that can't function
without this idea. I mean, that

1203
01:16:45,420 --> 01:16:48,510
can't function without the open
platform. Yep. It really just

1204
01:16:48,510 --> 01:16:52,200
can't. I mean, like, if there
is, okay, President Trump's

1205
01:16:52,200 --> 01:16:56,220
speeches, for instance. I mean,
there's, there's, I mean, it's

1206
01:16:56,220 --> 01:17:00,390
no, it's no secret that half the
world hates Trump indefinitely,

1207
01:17:00,390 --> 01:17:03,660
you know, and so, and there's
plenty of people that would love

1208
01:17:03,660 --> 01:17:07,680
to, like, if this podcast had to
get approved through, you know,

1209
01:17:07,680 --> 01:17:10,170
some third party, I mean, some
of them may not even approve it.

1210
01:17:10,170 --> 01:17:15,720
It's possible. I mean, there's,
you know, rigor in the thing is,

1211
01:17:15,720 --> 01:17:22,470
it's not just, whatever your
political bent, the things

1212
01:17:22,470 --> 01:17:27,570
change, and you have to be aware
of that political social

1213
01:17:27,570 --> 01:17:32,310
movements shift over time. And
so what, you know, we hear, we

1214
01:17:32,310 --> 01:17:37,860
heard this with, with, you know,
by Biden, and even Obama to a

1215
01:17:37,860 --> 01:17:41,670
certain extent, you know, years
ago, they ran on a platform of

1216
01:17:41,970 --> 01:17:46,110
being anti gay marriage, right.
And then they changed over time,

1217
01:17:46,110 --> 01:17:49,770
because the, because the, the
society moved in that direction,

1218
01:17:49,980 --> 01:17:51,870
and they changed, and now they
don't hold those positions

1219
01:17:51,870 --> 01:17:57,150
anymore. Well, society changes,
and what is wrong, what is

1220
01:17:57,150 --> 01:18:01,110
considered, you know, bad or
good, or whatever moral

1221
01:18:01,110 --> 01:18:06,060
objection you have to that now
can change over time and, and

1222
01:18:06,060 --> 01:18:09,000
also with your political
leanings. So you don't want to

1223
01:18:09,000 --> 01:18:14,640
tie yourself in to any one? You
don't, you know, just because

1224
01:18:14,640 --> 01:18:19,470
you feel that it's okay to
censor Alex Jones, or Trump or,

1225
01:18:19,650 --> 01:18:24,840
you know, whoever it is that
today? Well, five years from

1226
01:18:24,840 --> 01:18:28,800
now, they may be Trent, those
same entities that tried to

1227
01:18:28,830 --> 01:18:32,790
dismiss, you know, Alex Jones
may be trying to censor somebody

1228
01:18:32,790 --> 01:18:36,690
that you actually agree with,
because the society, the

1229
01:18:37,110 --> 01:18:40,650
proclivities of society moved
and shifted out from under you.

1230
01:18:41,220 --> 01:18:44,910
And so, it may be, it's easy to
say, well, I don't have a

1231
01:18:44,910 --> 01:18:50,310
problem with them taking down
Spotify, Apple, Amazon, taking

1232
01:18:50,310 --> 01:18:53,520
down, fill in the blank
podcaster, because I don't agree

1233
01:18:53,520 --> 01:18:54,600
with their political views.

1234
01:18:54,630 --> 01:19:00,540
I'll give you a better example.
Okay. Apple recently removed,

1235
01:19:01,170 --> 01:19:06,000
either a category or certain
podcasts from its Chinese

1236
01:19:06,000 --> 01:19:13,650
podcast index, related to some
Catholic podcasts, which is a

1237
01:19:13,650 --> 01:19:16,140
huge issue right now in China.
They're basically creating the

1238
01:19:16,140 --> 01:19:21,660
CPAs like, their own Catholic
Catholic Church, with their own

1239
01:19:21,660 --> 01:19:25,620
people. And somehow the Pope is
blessing him. So Apple had to

1240
01:19:25,620 --> 01:19:29,550
comply. Now, we're not in China,
but you know, what can happen

1241
01:19:29,550 --> 01:19:32,940
here can happen anywhere, all
this kind of stuff. And that's

1242
01:19:32,940 --> 01:19:37,860
just the pure censorship part.
You know, we say it's a platform

1243
01:19:37,860 --> 01:19:40,560
for free speech. That's the
idea. No one's gonna die from

1244
01:19:40,560 --> 01:19:45,090
this index. The bottom line, no
one's gonna die from this index.

1245
01:19:45,270 --> 01:19:49,050
It's constitutionally protected.
It's a bunch of feeds, and

1246
01:19:49,050 --> 01:19:51,990
pretty soon just be a bucket of
feeds. And everyone who was in

1247
01:19:51,990 --> 01:19:58,650
here now is developing. I have
Dave and I both have a lot of

1248
01:19:58,650 --> 01:20:01,170
things we could be doing with
our life. This brings us much

1249
01:20:01,170 --> 01:20:05,130
joy. We're very happy that we're
doing it. And I think we're

1250
01:20:05,130 --> 01:20:09,000
gonna see some opportunities.
You know, the second part of our

1251
01:20:09,000 --> 01:20:12,300
mission, which we're not there
yet, is to retool podcasting as

1252
01:20:12,300 --> 01:20:17,400
a platform of value. And when we
get to that, you know, that's my

1253
01:20:17,400 --> 01:20:21,630
hope is that there'll be money
flowing through the system in

1254
01:20:21,630 --> 01:20:25,320
the form of actual money or
value or something that people

1255
01:20:25,320 --> 01:20:28,830
will be able to measure, we'll
be able to capture, we'll be

1256
01:20:28,830 --> 01:20:33,570
able to feel good about. And
once we complete that, I think I

1257
01:20:33,570 --> 01:20:38,190
think it's off to the races, I
think. And I'm, I'm just so

1258
01:20:38,190 --> 01:20:42,030
stoked about IPFS. And all that.
There's so many opportunity, my

1259
01:20:42,030 --> 01:20:44,700
head is spinning right now, so
many opportunities. And we're

1260
01:20:44,700 --> 01:20:47,940
looking forward to anybody who
steps forward with any any

1261
01:20:47,940 --> 01:20:51,660
thinking any idea, we got to
GitHub, we've got the mastodon

1262
01:20:51,660 --> 01:20:56,220
server. And we'll just keep
updating on a weekly basis as we

1263
01:20:56,220 --> 01:21:00,390
go forward. And please remember
that we need support for this.

1264
01:21:00,420 --> 01:21:04,110
It's the three T's time, talent,
treasure, if you can support

1265
01:21:04,110 --> 01:21:08,130
with the with some funds to keep
it going. And to ensure its

1266
01:21:08,130 --> 01:21:11,400
future for now, until we get to
a point where this something

1267
01:21:11,400 --> 01:21:15,090
else is going on. We'd really
appreciate that at podcast

1268
01:21:15,090 --> 01:21:15,930
index.org.

1269
01:21:16,440 --> 01:21:20,130
Yeah, and that's the donations,
we got a lot of donations at the

1270
01:21:20,130 --> 01:21:23,670
beginning. And that was those.
So it was fantastic. It was very

1271
01:21:23,670 --> 01:21:27,630
encouraging, really encouraging.
And then they kind of fell off,

1272
01:21:27,660 --> 01:21:30,870
you know, predictably over the
last week. But if if anybody can

1273
01:21:30,870 --> 01:21:35,010
donate and it's not just
obviously, you know, citizen,

1274
01:21:35,160 --> 01:21:38,340
Pay Pal, if you can, but it's
not just that, if you're if you

1275
01:21:38,340 --> 01:21:41,700
work at a hosting company, and
you can, can help us out with

1276
01:21:41,700 --> 01:21:43,890
hosting fees or something like
that, that would be fantastic,

1277
01:21:43,890 --> 01:21:45,660
too. I mean, anything like that
is helpful.

1278
01:21:45,720 --> 01:21:49,260
And podcasters podcasters, talk
to your talk to your hosting

1279
01:21:49,260 --> 01:21:51,930
companies make sure that they
integrated as send them a link

1280
01:21:51,930 --> 01:21:57,120
to this show, so that they can,
they can follow along. And I'm

1281
01:21:57,120 --> 01:22:00,360
happy now we're always open for
email and questions. And the

1282
01:22:00,360 --> 01:22:03,060
mastodon is a great, great place
and other people jump in, and

1283
01:22:03,060 --> 01:22:05,040
we're really building a
community I'm quite, I'm quite

1284
01:22:05,040 --> 01:22:08,910
proud of the work that everybody
is doing. And Dave, I have to, I

1285
01:22:08,910 --> 01:22:11,760
gotta kiss your ass again, man,
you are really, you're really

1286
01:22:11,760 --> 01:22:16,470
doing yeoman's work here. It's
unbelievable how much, you're

1287
01:22:16,470 --> 01:22:19,500
also just really good and fast,
which just blows me away every

1288
01:22:19,500 --> 01:22:20,250
single time.

1289
01:22:22,530 --> 01:22:26,910
One of those two. Sometimes, you
know, you only get one you get

1290
01:22:26,910 --> 01:22:29,820
good or fast. And it alternates
between the two. Sometimes I'm

1291
01:22:29,820 --> 01:22:32,460
good. Sometimes I'm fast. Maybe
not. And maybe not both at the

1292
01:22:32,460 --> 01:22:32,850
same time. I

1293
01:22:32,879 --> 01:22:36,659
never had a complaint. Alright,
is there anything else we need

1294
01:22:36,659 --> 01:22:39,029
to cover? And we close down for
today?

1295
01:22:40,590 --> 01:22:43,320
Yeah, I guess the only other
thing I would say is that there

1296
01:22:43,320 --> 01:22:48,750
was some concern about this,
just being a free for all. And

1297
01:22:48,750 --> 01:22:51,630
like, they're just being a big
ad your feed button on the page.

1298
01:22:52,320 --> 01:22:55,830
And that is not going to happen.
That's not going to happen for

1299
01:22:56,220 --> 01:23:01,080
maybe ever Instagram. I don't I
still don't think to this day.

1300
01:23:01,080 --> 01:23:05,940
They allow posting through their
API. People, people, you know,

1301
01:23:06,570 --> 01:23:11,190
route around that and try to do
it illegally. But like, I would

1302
01:23:11,190 --> 01:23:13,710
much prefer, like we talked
about at the beginning to have

1303
01:23:13,710 --> 01:23:17,400
integrations with publishers and
networks. Yeah. I don't want the

1304
01:23:17,400 --> 01:23:21,870
big add your feed button. It's
on a main page somewhere where

1305
01:23:21,870 --> 01:23:24,630
it's a free for all. I don't
think anybody wants that. I

1306
01:23:24,630 --> 01:23:25,440
don't think we want that

1307
01:23:25,440 --> 01:23:29,460
either. No. And as we pointed
out, by doing it this way, we

1308
01:23:29,460 --> 01:23:33,000
really do create a platform, a
platform that is bigger than

1309
01:23:33,000 --> 01:23:37,530
just one individual piece, and
it becomes redundant. And when

1310
01:23:37,530 --> 01:23:41,820
that happens, and it's an
everybody can, can start coming

1311
01:23:41,820 --> 01:23:44,640
up with some some different
ideas on what to do with the

1312
01:23:44,640 --> 01:23:48,240
data and the feeds and what is
possible. I think it's going to

1313
01:23:48,240 --> 01:23:49,800
kick everybody's ass.

1314
01:23:50,880 --> 01:23:53,940
Yeah, yeah, I hope so. Good.
That's all. That's all I got.

1315
01:23:54,000 --> 01:23:56,250
And if not, then we had some fun
with some servers.

1316
01:23:59,340 --> 01:24:00,900
And we have a 30 gig database.

1317
01:24:02,400 --> 01:24:05,340
Hey, David, have a great
weekend. Thank you so much, was

1318
01:24:05,340 --> 01:24:08,790
good week. And we'll catch up
again next week. And pretty soon

1319
01:24:08,790 --> 01:24:12,990
we'll bring in our third
partner, the shill. Guys, he's

1320
01:24:12,990 --> 01:24:16,260
running the back office and he
has some thoughts and, and we

1321
01:24:16,260 --> 01:24:19,320
love Him because then brought
him on board because he has all

1322
01:24:19,320 --> 01:24:22,470
the boring, and all the
questions we don't want to

1323
01:24:22,470 --> 01:24:23,550
answer. And

1324
01:24:23,580 --> 01:24:26,460
I'll need a terms of service.
What do you do? And?

1325
01:24:27,540 --> 01:24:29,700
Well, it's important. These are
things that we need to talk

1326
01:24:29,700 --> 01:24:32,070
about. And I think we're coming
up to that within a week or two,

1327
01:24:32,070 --> 01:24:36,570
we'll probably be pretty close
to some of those questions. And

1328
01:24:36,570 --> 01:24:39,540
that's what he does. And that's,
that's why I've learned I've

1329
01:24:39,540 --> 01:24:43,920
started a lot of companies. And
if you can get the guy who will

1330
01:24:43,920 --> 01:24:47,280
ask you those irritating
questions. That's it's a good

1331
01:24:47,280 --> 01:24:49,320
thing to have. So it's a very
good thing to have.

1332
01:24:49,350 --> 01:24:51,990
Hey, can we interview some uh,
can we like has interviewed

1333
01:24:51,990 --> 01:24:53,700
somebody on this show sometime?
I'd like

1334
01:24:53,700 --> 01:24:55,890
to, but let's do it next week.
Who do you want to have on?

1335
01:24:56,370 --> 01:25:01,860
Oh, whoever will talk to us. I
mean, we get We get out. Well

1336
01:25:01,860 --> 01:25:06,120
James is in Australia. That
might be a mix timing as

1337
01:25:06,300 --> 01:25:10,140
possible, but it sucks. We'll
figure somebody out.

1338
01:25:11,429 --> 01:25:15,089
Raise your hands everybody.
Okay, that's it. Episode number

1339
01:25:15,089 --> 01:25:17,009
three. We're gonna leave it
there for now. We will be back.

1340
01:25:17,009 --> 01:25:18,809
We'll do another show on Friday.
We'll see if we can bring

1341
01:25:18,809 --> 01:25:23,669
somebody in. If someone has got
my eye on the mastodon info ID

1342
01:25:23,669 --> 01:25:27,119
podcast index.org I'm Adam
podcast index.org and David

1343
01:25:27,119 --> 01:25:32,249
podcasts index.org. If you're
not a developer already. If

1344
01:25:32,249 --> 01:25:34,739
you're a developer, you're not
there already. Probably get in

1345
01:25:34,739 --> 01:25:39,629
on it. And, and give me a web
app. Dammit. I want to give me a

1346
01:25:39,629 --> 01:25:42,389
search or something. Something
fun to look at. Hey, Dave had a

1347
01:25:42,389 --> 01:25:46,829
good weekend, buddy. So much
okay, ma'am. And we'll be back

1348
01:25:46,829 --> 01:25:49,949
next week to continue podcasting
2.0